I would like him a lot of if he hadn't change the name, flag, and national anthem (could've just change the lyrics).
Zaire > DRC
Zaire > DRC
Does Laurent Kabila (rip) deserve his National Heroe status?status?
Hindsight has 20-20 vision and in light of what's transpired in DRC over the past 20 years, does Laurent Kabila deserve his National Hero status?
Nothing personal, just a discussion as we can now look back at the events more clearly as more time has passed
Nothing personal, just a discussion as we can now look back at the events more clearly as more time has passed
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
To be honest though, what did he do to deserve the hero status?
No.
His rise to power is a human catastrophe.
He accomplished nothing, . Simply. D grade.
His rise to power is a human catastrophe.
He accomplished nothing, . Simply. D grade.
"Prennez vous en charge, Organisez vous", LDK.
This phrase must tought in academia starting from elementary school.
I think another phrase is "Never betray the fatherland"
This phrase must tought in academia starting from elementary school.
I think another phrase is "Never betray the fatherland"
You should understand him on this though. Due to his political beliefs and ideology.I would like him a lot of if he hadn't change the name, flag, and national anthem (could've just change the lyrics).
Zaire > DRC
However, he doesn't deserve hero status. that's reserved for those who accomplish great things.
He supposedly "liberated" the country from Mobutu's grip, only to land us in deeper sh*t than we were already in. Along with Kagame, Kaberere and Kanambe, LDK has to take blame for the genocide that took and is taking place in DRC since they all came into the picture.To be honest though, what did he do to deserve the hero status?
The ultimate failure though for me remains Mobutu as the country should never have been so vulnerable in the first place, especially given the support from the West that he enjoyed for an uninterrupted 20+ years.
****! I'm still mad at him for changing the name and flag!!! :lol:
I don't really care more about that....i care more about security and defense. That's where he really pissed ne off most about.
Don't worry the name will come back one day, but flag probably not.****! I'm still mad at him for changing the name and flag!!! :lol:
eteya biso :cheers:
To answer your question, LD Kabila is not the only hero national in Kanambe reign. Do you still remember the late Katumbe Mweke; he is in the same title as Lumumba. Have you hear him say anything in public about M.Ndala? What Katumbe Mwake did more to be hero national but not Ndala?
The Devil is in the detail.
The idiot Kanambe promote people by sentiment, as soon as we have a new regime all this will change, and they would remove LD body in the middle of Gombe so they could bury him in his nativity village, in peace.
eteya biso :cheers:
The Devil is in the detail.
The idiot Kanambe promote people by sentiment, as soon as we have a new regime all this will change, and they would remove LD body in the middle of Gombe so they could bury him in his nativity village, in peace.
eteya biso :cheers:
LOL at Katumba Mwanke being a hero :lol: one of the biggest joke in human history :hahaha: Hero of the thieves.
It shows the level of brain Joka got. to low to be a normal person.
It shows the level of brain Joka got. to low to be a normal person.
Anyone who can bring a monster like Kanambe in our country couldn’t be qualified as a hero.
eteya biso :cheers:
eteya biso :cheers:
Does Laurent Désiré Kabila deserve a hero status? What is a hero? According to Oxford dictionary, a hero is “a person who is admired for their courage, outstanding achievements, or noble qualities”. Is it the case as far as LDK is concerned? To answer this question we need to use historical facts as a guiding light.
First, let us skip his early guerrilla struggle against the Mobutu regime because it led to nothing politically and he ended up as a gold and ivory smuggler between Zaire, Tanzania and Uganda.
In 1996, did LDK initiate the so-called “liberation war” against the Mobutu regime that led to regime change in Zaire or was he a co-initiator?
No, the initiative came from the Rwandan regime which, later, involved Uganda and Tanzania. As the necessity to put a Zairian face to the rebellion arose, Rwanda recruited two Tutsi-Zairians, Anselme Masasu Nindaga (Mouvement Révolutionnaire pour la Libération du Zaire) and Déogratias Bugera (ADP). As for Uganda, they recruited André Kisase Ngandu (Conseil National de Résistance pour la Démocratie). Tanzania brought Laurent Désiré Kabila (Parti de la Révolution Populaire) into the mix. Apart from Kisase Ngandu, none of these rebel groups had a military force.
How did AFDL (Alliance des Forces Démocratiques pour la Libération du Congo-Zaire) come about and what is the so-called Lemera Agreement?
According to the legend, the agreement between the four rebel groups creating AFDL was signed in Lemera in South Kivu on October 18, 1996. In reality, the agreement was not signed in Lemera/ South Kivu, but in Lemera in Kigali/ Rwanda. After the recruitment of the four Zairian rebel groups, Colonel James Kabarebe and General Paul Kagame accommodated Laurent Kabila, Masasu Nindaga, Kisase Ngandu and Déogratias Bugera in a house in Lemera and gave them a couple of days to create a unified rebel force. Upon the creation of ADFL, Laurent Kabila was designated as the new rebel group's spokesman, partly because of his seniority.
Why and how did Kisase Ngandu die?
Kisase Ngandu was a true nationalist. As Goma fell to the Rwanda coalition, Kisase Ngandu declared on November 20, “Now we have to think for ourselves...Our main problems are how to use taxes, a fair administration and freedom for all Zaire”. He was increasingly vocal and he recruited easily. Those who joined him were usually those who wanted to bring Mobutu down but who did not trust Kigali. As a result Kigali Kigali considered him with growing distrust. Laurent Kabila, however, took the opposite stance. According to professor Gérard Prunier, he was behaving in a very subservient way towards the “tall ones” (the Tutsi). He acquired the ironic nickname of “Ndiyo Bwana”, meaning “yes sir” in Kiswahili, because it was his usual answer to whatever the Rwandans were telling him.
On one famous occasion, Kisase stopped the RPA soldiers (Rwandan Patriotic Army) from Taking a large electric generator from Goma Airport to Rwanda, saying that it belonged to the congolese state and that he was accountable to that state and not Kigali. As the Mayi Mayi problem was developing, Kisase headed to Butembo to take care of situation. In the last minute before departure, his body guards were removed by the APR and replaced by some of Kabila's and those Body guards killed him on the way. Kabila then lied about the murder on January 17, saying that Kisase “had been wounded by the Mayi Mayi, was hospitalized and would soon be back”.
Were the “kadogos” (AFDL's child soldiers) instrumental in the victory against the Mobutu regime?
No. First of all, the war initiative came from Rwanda and it was Rwandan and Ugandan soldiers and Eritrean mercenaries who were in the front-line and directed all military operations. The kadogos served as porters. As the war moved west, it was Angolan soldiers (FAPLA) who fought the battle of Kenge that led to the fall of Kinshasa. The kadogos did not have combat experience to fight a war.
Why did Laurent Kabila make colonel James Kabarebe, a high ranking Rwandan military officer, Congolese army chief of staff and lied publicly to the Congolese people about Kabarebe's nationality, saying that he was a Congolese? And why did he hinder the UN's investigation into the genocide of the Hutus on Congolese soil, accepting therefore to appear as an accomplice to the crimes?
It was the recognition of the fact that the country was not liberated by him but by foreigners and the latter were entitled to the spoils of war which included the country's sovereignty. The refusal to let the UN investigate into crimes committed by Rwanda on Congolese soil was the proof that LDK was caught between a rock and a hard place, knowing that whatever decision he made was to have negative consequences for him. Allowing the investigation would equate to betraying his Rwandan minders who would “punish” him. Refusing to let the UN investigators into the country (or to the crime scenes) would mean international isolation for him and possible criminal indictment. He chose the lesser of the two evils: international isolation...
Was sending Rwandan soldiers home an act of courage on the part of LDK?
All evidence point to the fact that he did not do it on his own volition but because the popular pressure to do so was becoming unbearable.
Once again, heroism is made of three elements: courage, outstanding achievements and noble qualities. Are those elements (or at least one of them) to be found in LDK's personality?
Judging by the above biographical elements, my personal answer is no.
First, let us skip his early guerrilla struggle against the Mobutu regime because it led to nothing politically and he ended up as a gold and ivory smuggler between Zaire, Tanzania and Uganda.
In 1996, did LDK initiate the so-called “liberation war” against the Mobutu regime that led to regime change in Zaire or was he a co-initiator?
No, the initiative came from the Rwandan regime which, later, involved Uganda and Tanzania. As the necessity to put a Zairian face to the rebellion arose, Rwanda recruited two Tutsi-Zairians, Anselme Masasu Nindaga (Mouvement Révolutionnaire pour la Libération du Zaire) and Déogratias Bugera (ADP). As for Uganda, they recruited André Kisase Ngandu (Conseil National de Résistance pour la Démocratie). Tanzania brought Laurent Désiré Kabila (Parti de la Révolution Populaire) into the mix. Apart from Kisase Ngandu, none of these rebel groups had a military force.
How did AFDL (Alliance des Forces Démocratiques pour la Libération du Congo-Zaire) come about and what is the so-called Lemera Agreement?
According to the legend, the agreement between the four rebel groups creating AFDL was signed in Lemera in South Kivu on October 18, 1996. In reality, the agreement was not signed in Lemera/ South Kivu, but in Lemera in Kigali/ Rwanda. After the recruitment of the four Zairian rebel groups, Colonel James Kabarebe and General Paul Kagame accommodated Laurent Kabila, Masasu Nindaga, Kisase Ngandu and Déogratias Bugera in a house in Lemera and gave them a couple of days to create a unified rebel force. Upon the creation of ADFL, Laurent Kabila was designated as the new rebel group's spokesman, partly because of his seniority.
Why and how did Kisase Ngandu die?
Kisase Ngandu was a true nationalist. As Goma fell to the Rwanda coalition, Kisase Ngandu declared on November 20, “Now we have to think for ourselves...Our main problems are how to use taxes, a fair administration and freedom for all Zaire”. He was increasingly vocal and he recruited easily. Those who joined him were usually those who wanted to bring Mobutu down but who did not trust Kigali. As a result Kigali Kigali considered him with growing distrust. Laurent Kabila, however, took the opposite stance. According to professor Gérard Prunier, he was behaving in a very subservient way towards the “tall ones” (the Tutsi). He acquired the ironic nickname of “Ndiyo Bwana”, meaning “yes sir” in Kiswahili, because it was his usual answer to whatever the Rwandans were telling him.
On one famous occasion, Kisase stopped the RPA soldiers (Rwandan Patriotic Army) from Taking a large electric generator from Goma Airport to Rwanda, saying that it belonged to the congolese state and that he was accountable to that state and not Kigali. As the Mayi Mayi problem was developing, Kisase headed to Butembo to take care of situation. In the last minute before departure, his body guards were removed by the APR and replaced by some of Kabila's and those Body guards killed him on the way. Kabila then lied about the murder on January 17, saying that Kisase “had been wounded by the Mayi Mayi, was hospitalized and would soon be back”.
Were the “kadogos” (AFDL's child soldiers) instrumental in the victory against the Mobutu regime?
No. First of all, the war initiative came from Rwanda and it was Rwandan and Ugandan soldiers and Eritrean mercenaries who were in the front-line and directed all military operations. The kadogos served as porters. As the war moved west, it was Angolan soldiers (FAPLA) who fought the battle of Kenge that led to the fall of Kinshasa. The kadogos did not have combat experience to fight a war.
Why did Laurent Kabila make colonel James Kabarebe, a high ranking Rwandan military officer, Congolese army chief of staff and lied publicly to the Congolese people about Kabarebe's nationality, saying that he was a Congolese? And why did he hinder the UN's investigation into the genocide of the Hutus on Congolese soil, accepting therefore to appear as an accomplice to the crimes?
It was the recognition of the fact that the country was not liberated by him but by foreigners and the latter were entitled to the spoils of war which included the country's sovereignty. The refusal to let the UN investigate into crimes committed by Rwanda on Congolese soil was the proof that LDK was caught between a rock and a hard place, knowing that whatever decision he made was to have negative consequences for him. Allowing the investigation would equate to betraying his Rwandan minders who would “punish” him. Refusing to let the UN investigators into the country (or to the crime scenes) would mean international isolation for him and possible criminal indictment. He chose the lesser of the two evils: international isolation...
Was sending Rwandan soldiers home an act of courage on the part of LDK?
All evidence point to the fact that he did not do it on his own volition but because the popular pressure to do so was becoming unbearable.
Once again, heroism is made of three elements: courage, outstanding achievements and noble qualities. Are those elements (or at least one of them) to be found in LDK's personality?
Judging by the above biographical elements, my personal answer is no.
One could argue LDK could qualify for national hero status based on his rallying Congolese forces to fight off and repulse Rwandan invaders when they attacked Kinshasa in the summer of 1998...Does Laurent Désiré Kabila deserve a hero status? What is a hero? According to Oxford dictionary, a hero is “a person who is admired for their courage, outstanding achievements, or noble qualities”. Is it the case as far as LDK is concerned? To answer this question we need to use historical facts as a guiding light.
First, let us skip his early guerrilla struggle against the Mobutu regime because it led to nothing politically and he ended up as a gold and ivory smuggler between Zaire, Tanzania and Uganda.
In 1996, did LDK initiate the so-called “liberation war” against the Mobutu regime that led to regime change in Zaire or was he a co-initiator?
No, the initiative came from the Rwandan regime which, later, involved Uganda and Tanzania. As the necessity to put a Zairian face to the rebellion arose, Rwanda recruited two Tutsi-Zairians, Anselme Masasu Nindaga (Mouvement Révolutionnaire pour la Libération du Zaire) and Déogratias Bugera (ADP). As for Uganda, they recruited André Kisase Ngandu (Conseil National de Résistance pour la Démocratie). Tanzania brought Laurent Désiré Kabila (Parti de la Révolution Populaire) into the mix. Apart from Kisase Ngandu, none of these rebel groups had a military force.
How did AFDL (Alliance des Forces Démocratiques pour la Libération du Congo-Zaire) come about and what is the so-called Lemera Agreement?
According to the legend, the agreement between the four rebel groups creating AFDL was signed in Lemera in South Kivu on October 18, 1996. In reality, the agreement was not signed in Lemera/ South Kivu, but in Lemera in Kigali/ Rwanda. After the recruitment of the four Zairian rebel groups, Colonel James Kabarebe and General Paul Kagame accommodated Laurent Kabila, Masasu Nindaga, Kisase Ngandu and Déogratias Bugera in a house in Lemera and gave them a couple of days to create a unified rebel force. Upon the creation of ADFL, Laurent Kabila was designated as the new rebel group's spokesman, partly because of his seniority.
Why and how did Kisase Ngandu die?
Kisase Ngandu was a true nationalist. As Goma fell to the Rwanda coalition, Kisase Ngandu declared on November 20, “Now we have to think for ourselves...Our main problems are how to use taxes, a fair administration and freedom for all Zaire”. He was increasingly vocal and he recruited easily. Those who joined him were usually those who wanted to bring Mobutu down but who did not trust Kigali. As a result Kigali Kigali considered him with growing distrust. Laurent Kabila, however, took the opposite stance. According to professor Gérard Prunier, he was behaving in a very subservient way towards the “tall ones” (the Tutsi). He acquired the ironic nickname of “Ndiyo Bwana”, meaning “yes sir” in Kiswahili, because it was his usual answer to whatever the Rwandans were telling him.
On one famous occasion, Kisase stopped the RPA soldiers (Rwandan Patriotic Army) from Taking a large electric generator from Goma Airport to Rwanda, saying that it belonged to the congolese state and that he was accountable to that state and not Kigali. As the Mayi Mayi problem was developing, Kisase headed to Butembo to take care of situation. In the last minute before departure, his body guards were removed by the APR and replaced by some of Kabila's and those Body guards killed him on the way. Kabila then lied about the murder on January 17, saying that Kisase “had been wounded by the Mayi Mayi, was hospitalized and would soon be back”.
Were the “kadogos” (AFDL's child soldiers) instrumental in the victory against the Mobutu regime?
No. First of all, the war initiative came from Rwanda and it was Rwandan and Ugandan soldiers and Eritrean mercenaries who were in the front-line and directed all military operations. The kadogos served as porters. As the war moved west, it was Angolan soldiers (FAPLA) who fought the battle of Kenge that led to the fall of Kinshasa. The kadogos did not have combat experience to fight a war.
Why did Laurent Kabila make colonel James Kabarebe, a high ranking Rwandan military officer, Congolese army chief of staff and lied publicly to the Congolese people about Kabarebe's nationality, saying that he was a Congolese? And why did he hinder the UN's investigation into the genocide of the Hutus on Congolese soil, accepting therefore to appear as an accomplice to the crimes?
It was the recognition of the fact that the country was not liberated by him but by foreigners and the latter were entitled to the spoils of war which included the country's sovereignty. The refusal to let the UN investigate into crimes committed by Rwanda on Congolese soil was the proof that LDK was caught between a rock and a hard place, knowing that whatever decision he made was to have negative consequences for him. Allowing the investigation would equate to betraying his Rwandan minders who would “punish” him. Refusing to let the UN investigators into the country (or to the crime scenes) would mean international isolation for him and possible criminal indictment. He chose the lesser of the two evils: international isolation...
Was sending Rwandan soldiers home an act of courage on the part of LDK?
All evidence point to the fact that he did not do it on his own volition but because the popular pressure to do so was becoming unbearable.
Once again, heroism is made of three elements: courage, outstanding achievements and noble qualities. Are those elements (or at least one of them) to be found in LDK's personality?
Judging by the above biographical elements, my personal answer is no.
Meaning his credibility for this national hero status mostly rests on his actions after Aug 1998, not before....
This is another myth that needs to be debunked. As the insurgency started in Goma on August 2, 1998, Kabila was indeed in Kinshasa and he tried to rally Congolese forces to fight off and repulse Rwandan invaders. However, as James Kabarebe's troops approached the outskirts of Kinshasa, Kabila fled to Lubumbashi and left both his government and the people in Kinshasa helpless. He did not even make a locally televised address. It was Didier Mumengi, the information minister, and Tshala Mwana, the singer, who took to the streets of Kinshasa to rally the population and appeared on national television to calm the population. Kabila ordered his entire cabinet to Lubumbashi. Senior members of government, especially those from Katanga, heeded his call. Kabila returned to Kinshasa after Angolan and Zimbabwean troops intervened and neutralized the rebels. A true hero does not flee the battlefield and wait for foreign troops to save the day. If this is the episode where Kabila proved his “heroism”, then he is definitely not a hero.One could argue LDK could qualify for national hero status based on his rallying Congolese forces to fight off and repulse Rwandan invaders when they attacked Kinshasa in the summer of 1998...
Meaning his credibility for this national hero status mostly rests on his actions after Aug 1998, not before....
So it must be the events right after the foreign intervention was completed that were cemented on people's minds about LDK's legacy....This is another myth that needs to be debunked. As the insurgency started in Goma on August 2, 1998, Kabila was indeed in Kinshasa and he tried to rally Congolese forces to fight off and repulse Rwandan invaders. However, as James Kabarebe's troops approached the outskirts of Kinshasa, Kabila fled to Lubumbashi and left both his government and the people in Kinshasa helpless. He did not even make a locally televised address. It was Didier Mumengi, the information minister, and Tshala Mwana, the singer, who took to the streets of Kinshasa to rally the population and appeared on national television to calm the population. Kabila ordered his entire cabinet to Lubumbashi. Senior members of government, especially those from Katanga, heeded his call. Kabila returned to Kinshasa after Angolan and Zimbabwean troops intervened and neutralized the rebels. A true hero does not flee the battlefield and wait for foreign troops to save the day. If this is the episode where Kabila proved his heroism, then he is definitely not a hero.
Especially the episode when civilians reacted against retreating rebels in Tshangu....I had a friend there during that time in the action zone...They all kept saying they're following LDK's rally cry in attacking and burning retreating rebels..
LDK made this rally cry after the invasion began on August 2, 1998. As the AFDL troops began to infiltrate the outskirts of Kinshasa, LDK fled to Lubumbashi only to come back to Kinshasa on September 9, after all was over. He did not stay to fight with his people. Remember: during the battle of Kinshasa that resulted in the fall of the Mobutu regime, LDK stayed safely in Lubumbashi until James Kabarebe announced him on the phone that the conquest was achieved and that he could come to Kinshasa. And he came... in the night. LDK was not a fighter, a war hero, a liberator...So it must be the events right after the foreign intervention was completed that were cemented on people's minds about LDK's legacy....
Especially the episode when civilians reacted against retreating rebels in Tshangu....I had a friend there during that time in the action zone...They all kept saying they're following LDK's rally cry in attacking and burning retreating rebels..
People tend to have a short memory a forget that LDK was the most unpopular president Kinshasa had ever known before his death. His political, economic and social policies were a disaster. He owes his post-mortem popularity to his tragic death. As the Romans said “De mortuis nihil nisi bene” (Of the dead, speak no evil).
LDK made this rally cry after the invasion began on August 2, 1998. As the AFDL troops began to infiltrate the outskirts of Kinshasa, LDK fled to Lubumbashi only to come back to Kinshasa on September 9, after all was over. He did not stay to fight with his people. Remember: during the battle of Kinshasa that resulted in the fall of the Mobutu regime, LDK stayed safely in Lubumbashi until James Kabarebe announced him on the phone that the conquest was achieved and that he could come to Kinshasa. And he came... in the night. LDK was not a fighter, a war hero, a liberator...
People tend to have a short memory a forget that LDK was the most unpopular president Kinshasa had ever known before his death. His political, economic and social policies were a disaster. He owes his post-mortem popularity to his tragic death. As the Romans said “De mortuis nihil nisi bene” (Of the dead, speak no evil).
Since being national hero depends on military prowess, so then What did Lumumba do to get that recognition...:sad2::sad2: ?
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