Whilst I'm generally in favour of reopening schemes, what seems to be on offer here doesn't really seem worth the costs which are being quoted. The report has essentially come up with two options for the eastern section of the line, neither of which is up to much. Either track is relaid as far as Sandy to join with the ECML as far as Hitchin then using the existing line from there to Cambridge, or a chord from Stewartby to the MML to reach Luton from where a new line is laid to Stevenage where the ECML takes us back to Hitchin and then onto Cambridge. Neither of the options offers the direct route between Oxford and Cambridge which made the route worthwhile in the first place, and both will create even more pathing problems on already busy main lines. Imho, it's better just to get to Sandy and at some point in the future, rebuild the remainder of the line along the original alignment.
East West Rail
After the recent successes on the western section of the proposed east west line - 1) The signing of the agreement with Chiltern and 2)the commencement of detailed design work for the western section, East West rail are turning their attention to the 'missing gap' between the Midland Main line at Bedford and the East Coast Main line.
A recently issued consultation puts forward a number of options to 'bridge' this gap but seems to favour a southerly route on the MML to Luton entailing construction of a new short link from the Marston Vale Line near Stewartby and then south on the MML to Luton (including the airport) then on a new alignment to Stevenage and then onward to Cambridge and beyond.
http://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/reports/
Some interesting pictures and and models of potential services are included
A recently issued consultation puts forward a number of options to 'bridge' this gap but seems to favour a southerly route on the MML to Luton entailing construction of a new short link from the Marston Vale Line near Stewartby and then south on the MML to Luton (including the airport) then on a new alignment to Stevenage and then onward to Cambridge and beyond.
http://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/reports/
Some interesting pictures and and models of potential services are included
1 - 20 of 888 Posts
It does seem a little bit 'uppy downy' and the Luton route, whilst good for the airport, would skip Bedford.
It seems there isn't a compromise from the main aim of Oxford - Cambridge not via London. It also looks as if many services would start from Reading, which makes sense, and that Milton Keynes is important too - but through services will only go via Bletchley which isn't ideal either as it's not where the CBD or Virgin West Coast are.
So clearly there's no perfect route for this one purpose, but I think it's expanded slightly from the original romantic notion of Oxbridge links.
Ironically the quickest, neatest and maybe most cheapest way to link to two cities would have been via Superlink/a fleshed out Crossrail - which still could happen I suppose, with electrification to Oxford, and up the Lea Valley line from Stratford.
It seems there isn't a compromise from the main aim of Oxford - Cambridge not via London. It also looks as if many services would start from Reading, which makes sense, and that Milton Keynes is important too - but through services will only go via Bletchley which isn't ideal either as it's not where the CBD or Virgin West Coast are.
So clearly there's no perfect route for this one purpose, but I think it's expanded slightly from the original romantic notion of Oxbridge links.
Ironically the quickest, neatest and maybe most cheapest way to link to two cities would have been via Superlink/a fleshed out Crossrail - which still could happen I suppose, with electrification to Oxford, and up the Lea Valley line from Stratford.
Will they build a west-east line too, so that trains don't have to take a convoluted route back to where they started from?
Bletchley is where the line crosses WCML and rerouting via Milton Keynes Central (without branching and reversing) requires an extra line between East West Rail and MKC, and along A421 to Bedford. The only way round would be making Blechley a Virgin stop, or incresing the frequency of services between MK-Blechley to a metro level.It does seem a little bit 'uppy downy' and the Luton route, whilst good for the airport, would skip Bedford.
It seems there isn't a compromise from the main aim of Oxford - Cambridge not via London. It also looks as if many services would start from Reading, which makes sense, and that Milton Keynes is important too - but through services will only go via Bletchley which isn't ideal either as it's not where the CBD or Virgin West Coast are.
So clearly there's no perfect route for this one purpose, but I think it's expanded slightly from the original romantic notion of Oxbridge links.
Ironically the quickest, neatest and maybe most cheapest way to link to two cities would have been via Superlink/a fleshed out Crossrail - which still could happen I suppose, with electrification to Oxford, and up the Lea Valley line from Stratford.
By the way, what will be the design speed of East West Rail?
I know all this, I was merely saying it was unfortunate. Maybe the MK Central area should have been built around Bletchley instead...
Milton Keynes really needs a tram system, car usage there is practically American. There are already lots of skater-inhabited dive unders around the centre.
Milton Keynes really needs a tram system, car usage there is practically American. There are already lots of skater-inhabited dive unders around the centre.
A number of years ago I seem to remember reading some documents with regards to the 2nd Generation new towns of which MK was a part of.
Given mistakes were made with the early new towns the plan was to return to the Garden City Movement which had provided Letchworth, Welwyn, and Hampstead Garden suburb, however this was with one subtle difference they forsaw that the car would become a mode of choice, and so each home in the twon was planned to be no more than a few minutes walk from a bus stop initially and as the town grew that plans for a more robust 'transit system' were to be started, when construction of the new Milton Keynes was started in the early 1960's, Beeching was starting his rail cuts and funding which was to be used for the proposed 'transit system' were used elsewhere and the routes which were to be used for the them were 'converted' into the 'redways network' of cycle routes.
However I can imagine given the grid network of roads/dual carriageways in the town a tram system would be comparatively easy to plan for, given the plans to expand MK to double its current size, I would think such an idea would be used, this tram system could then be used to link the Varsity line into MK.
Given mistakes were made with the early new towns the plan was to return to the Garden City Movement which had provided Letchworth, Welwyn, and Hampstead Garden suburb, however this was with one subtle difference they forsaw that the car would become a mode of choice, and so each home in the twon was planned to be no more than a few minutes walk from a bus stop initially and as the town grew that plans for a more robust 'transit system' were to be started, when construction of the new Milton Keynes was started in the early 1960's, Beeching was starting his rail cuts and funding which was to be used for the proposed 'transit system' were used elsewhere and the routes which were to be used for the them were 'converted' into the 'redways network' of cycle routes.
However I can imagine given the grid network of roads/dual carriageways in the town a tram system would be comparatively easy to plan for, given the plans to expand MK to double its current size, I would think such an idea would be used, this tram system could then be used to link the Varsity line into MK.
Do you think Milton Keynes and Bedford will eventually need a metro after Marston Vale area is fully developed (some people predict that they may develop into a single large suburban area once this gap is filled)? The Blechley-Beford line will probably become the core of the system I reckon...A number of years ago I seem to remember reading some documents with regards to the 2nd Generation new towns of which MK was a part of.
Given mistakes were made with the early new towns the plan was to return to the Garden City Movement which had provided Letchworth, Welwyn, and Hampstead Garden suburb, however this was with one subtle difference they forsaw that the car would become a mode of choice, and so each home in the twon was planned to be no more than a few minutes walk from a bus stop initially and as the town grew that plans for a more robust 'transit system' were to be started, when construction of the new Milton Keynes was started in the early 1960's, Beeching was starting his rail cuts and funding which was to be used for the proposed 'transit system' were used elsewhere and the routes which were to be used for the them were 'converted' into the 'redways network' of cycle routes.
However I can imagine given the grid network of roads/dual carriageways in the town a tram system would be comparatively easy to plan for, given the plans to expand MK to double its current size, I would think such an idea would be used, this tram system could then be used to link the Varsity line into MK.
Site investigation continues on East West Rail
Milton Keynes Partnership Press release
28 October 2009
Outline design work continues apace on the western section of East West Rail with additional site investigation starting this month. The work will include excavating trial trenches along the route and making a number of boreholes to help engineers understand the condition of the ground before designing any necessary ground improvements.
The site investigation is expected to last until the end of this year after which a detailed geotechnical report will be published and will enable the design of new track and railway infrastructure to be completed.
Earlier this year the disused section between Claydon and Bletchley was cleared of vegetation to allow engineers to access the track to carry out survey work and inspect the route prior to carrying out these further site investigations.
John Lewis, Chief Executive of Milton Keynes Partnership, said: “While these investigations are happening the East West Rail Consortium is also reassessing the business case for re-opening of the railway with a view to evaluating the benefits that this would bring locally, regionally and nationally.”
This work is part of the Consortium’s drive to acquire regional and national funding in order to deliver East West Rail. Because of factors including the economic downturn, the time required to complete the statutory processes and to assemble the funding package the Consortium has revisited the programme for implementing the scheme and latest projections are to seek a start of construction in early 2014 and look to open the new train services in late 2015.
Neil Gibson, Strategic Director (Communities and Built Environment) at Buckinghamshire County Council, who chairs the East West Rail Consortium, said: “Whilst this may seem a long way off, there still is an enormous amount of planning work to be undertaken during the next stages of development, not least of which is potentially to promote the scheme under the new Planning Act 2008 which comes into force in March next year.”
http://www.miltonkeynespartnership.info/media_centre/press_releases.php?ID=146
Milton Keynes Partnership Press release
28 October 2009
Outline design work continues apace on the western section of East West Rail with additional site investigation starting this month. The work will include excavating trial trenches along the route and making a number of boreholes to help engineers understand the condition of the ground before designing any necessary ground improvements.
The site investigation is expected to last until the end of this year after which a detailed geotechnical report will be published and will enable the design of new track and railway infrastructure to be completed.
Earlier this year the disused section between Claydon and Bletchley was cleared of vegetation to allow engineers to access the track to carry out survey work and inspect the route prior to carrying out these further site investigations.
John Lewis, Chief Executive of Milton Keynes Partnership, said: “While these investigations are happening the East West Rail Consortium is also reassessing the business case for re-opening of the railway with a view to evaluating the benefits that this would bring locally, regionally and nationally.”
This work is part of the Consortium’s drive to acquire regional and national funding in order to deliver East West Rail. Because of factors including the economic downturn, the time required to complete the statutory processes and to assemble the funding package the Consortium has revisited the programme for implementing the scheme and latest projections are to seek a start of construction in early 2014 and look to open the new train services in late 2015.
Neil Gibson, Strategic Director (Communities and Built Environment) at Buckinghamshire County Council, who chairs the East West Rail Consortium, said: “Whilst this may seem a long way off, there still is an enormous amount of planning work to be undertaken during the next stages of development, not least of which is potentially to promote the scheme under the new Planning Act 2008 which comes into force in March next year.”
http://www.miltonkeynespartnership.info/media_centre/press_releases.php?ID=146
The GRIP4 business case has just been released for the Oxford/Bedford section and it's come up with a BCR of 4:1, i.e. very strong and in fact probably the highest I've seen for a new rail link.
http://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/reports/documents/EWRDraftOutlineBusinessCaseNTS_08062010_Final.pdf
http://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/reports/documents/EWRDraftOutlineBusinessCaseNTS_08062010_Final.pdf
To be expected really, its not building a whole new line from scratch or reinstating a former, its merley adding a connecting stretch to two existing lines which are already in use, hence much much lower cost but when looking at potential for end to end journeys very high revenue/benefits.
...but which would have then been MK South, not Central. Anyway, Bletchley was an established town, and by the time MK Central station was opened in the 80s, there was very little capacity to build anything in Bletchley anyway.Maybe the MK Central area should have been built around Bletchley instead...
IMHO, it's one of those "mistakes" of the late 20th century's "new town" programme. Bletchley developed at the intersection of major railway routes, so was a great place for intercity expresses to stop, offering great interchange. However, because of this, it was too expensive to develop new developments around, so they built a huge development nearby instead, focussed around the car. Now, the intercity expresses stop one station away from the junction, meaning services can't run as a pair of simple through routes, they have to have convoluted patterns that require additional capacity between Bletchley and MK so they can serve (and terminate) at MK, or greatly overburden the WCML slow services between Bletchley and MK....but which would have then been MK South, not Central. Anyway, Bletchley was an established town, and by the time MK Central station was opened in the 80s, there was very little capacity to build anything in Bletchley anyway.
You see a similar arrangement at Stevenage and Hitchin. A small number of intercity expresses stopped at Hitchin until Stevenage new town was built in the 70's, when it's station was moved south and the intercity trains then stopped there instead. If they'd rebuilt Hitchin properly with fast line platforms and separate platforms for the Cambridge branch, then they'd have a viable option for running the Cambridge services as a separate shuttle if required. Additionally, if a new link was built from Luton, the logical point to connect to would be Hitchin, not Stevenage. If nothing else, the line would have to head south after Luton Airport to be able to reach Stevenage, then would have a similar bottleneck (as between Bletchley and MK) up to Hitchin before being able to get to the Cambridge branch.
With solid plans in place to connect Milton Keynes to Oxford, surely the most cost effective solution would be to add a curve at Manston so that trains from Corby/Kettering can run onto Peterborough.
- Minimal reconstruction and a way of adding a new useful passenger service (Pet to Milton Keynes).
- improve freight routing - in particular for the trains to the eurohub in corby
In a perfect world, the actual link would be made by also reinstating the Wellingboro/Northhampton line to link all the Northamptonshire towns (recognizing that Peterboro was originally a part). This would also help reduce journeys on the choked local roads by providing a faster public transport option.
- Minimal reconstruction and a way of adding a new useful passenger service (Pet to Milton Keynes).
- improve freight routing - in particular for the trains to the eurohub in corby
In a perfect world, the actual link would be made by also reinstating the Wellingboro/Northhampton line to link all the Northamptonshire towns (recognizing that Peterboro was originally a part). This would also help reduce journeys on the choked local roads by providing a faster public transport option.
travelling east-west is very hard by road or rail.
I could have sworn that I've seen a document before with the route mapped out, but this contains some bits of it:With solid plans in place to connect Milton Keynes to Oxford, surely the most cost effective solution would be to add a curve at Manston so that trains from Corby/Kettering can run onto Peterborough.
- Minimal reconstruction and a way of adding a new useful passenger service (Pet to Milton Keynes).
- improve freight routing - in particular for the trains to the eurohub in corby
In a perfect world, the actual link would be made by also reinstating the Wellingboro/Northhampton line to link all the Northamptonshire towns (recognizing that Peterboro was originally a part). This would also help reduce journeys on the choked local roads by providing a faster public transport option.
http://www.eastwestrail.org.uk/reports/documents/CentralSectionReport-February2009.pdf
You can see that that they considered the route via Peterborough in great detail.
It might be useful to have that curve anyway, for flexibility, freight etc...
The Bicester - Oxford upgrade is a very small step in this project; it will enable 90mph running and mostly double track, but I think that has been scaled back in parts.
Chiltern are having open submissions for what the Evergreen 4 could be - and I'm sure that some options will be inadvertently beneficial for East West rail, such as the Aylesbury Vale extension continuing northwards, possibly to Bletchley/MK.
The Bicester - Oxford upgrade is a very small step in this project; it will enable 90mph running and mostly double track, but I think that has been scaled back in parts.
Chiltern are having open submissions for what the Evergreen 4 could be - and I'm sure that some options will be inadvertently beneficial for East West rail, such as the Aylesbury Vale extension continuing northwards, possibly to Bletchley/MK.
Absolutely. I live in Northampton, and it'd be extremely useful to be able to pick up the East Coast at Peterborough, travelling via the other main towns in Northants - Wellingborough, Kettering, Corby. A station at Brackmills, Northampton's main employment area and home of Barclaycard, a major employer, would be good as part of that line, even better if the line to Bedford was reinstated, which would give good links to Luton Airport, St Pancras for Eurostar, the City, Gatwick Airport and on to the seaside at Brighton!With solid plans in place to connect Milton Keynes to Oxford, surely the most cost effective solution would be to add a curve at Manston so that trains from Corby/Kettering can run onto Peterborough.
- Minimal reconstruction and a way of adding a new useful passenger service (Pet to Milton Keynes).
- improve freight routing - in particular for the trains to the eurohub in corby
In a perfect world, the actual link would be made by also reinstating the Wellingboro/Northhampton line to link all the Northamptonshire towns (recognizing that Peterboro was originally a part). This would also help reduce journeys on the choked local roads by providing a faster public transport option.
All possible and very sensible and beneficial. And probably never gonna happen.:bash:
Actually, I seem too recall reopening the line from Northampton to Bedford was on the radar as a Thameslink extension at one point....even better if the line to Bedford was reinstated, which would give good links to Luton Airport, St Pancras for Eurostar, the City, Gatwick Airport and on to the seaside at Brighton!
All possible and very sensible and beneficial. And probably never gonna happen.:bash:
Somewhere in the back of my mental attic lies a cob-web covered thought that says this alignment has now been lost to development. Is this correct?Actually, I seem too recall reopening the line from Northampton to Bedford was on the radar as a Thameslink extension at one point.
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