Skyscraper City Forum banner
1 - 20 of 126 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I thought I would start a thread on the dilemna facing Everton FC in it's desire to find a new home.

As a founder member of the football league, the oldest club in the city and the 4th most succesfull honoured club in Britain it is essential to keep the club within the city....but where and how?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
BACKGROUND

BACKGROUND: The failed Kings Dock "Waterfront Stadium and Arena" project.


The design:

Evertons design architects were HOK Sport who operate the world's biggest architecture practice out of offices in London, Kansas City and Brisbane. HOK's specialty is the design of sports, leisure and entertainment venues. Their European sports projects include the English National Stadium at Wembley, the Millennium Stadium at Cardiff Arms Park and the Commonwealth Stadium in Manchester. Worldwide, HOK Sport designed Stadium Australia in Sydney, the magnificent Olympic venue. Other projects include the United Centre in Chicago.

According to HOK the stadia consultants, the new stadium would be along the lines of the Colonial stadium in Melbourne, which features a retractable roof opening or closing within 8 minutes.

The Colonial Stadium……




The Everton bid for the Kings Dock site site was impressive.
The core of the proposal was a 55,000 all-seater arena (including 70 Executive boxes and 2,750 "Business Seats") with: retractable roof, retractable pitch, three tiered design of function rooms and restaurants.

The venue was to have a capacity for conferences of 5,000 (excluding the arena format) and provide for 3,000 Restaurant/Banqueting capacity, 10,000 m² of exhibition space and 2,800 car parking spaces

The arena was designed to convert into a 20,000 seater multi-purpose arena via a moveable section of the seating behind one goal. The bank of seats moves into the centre of the pitch for concert viewing.

In addition, the pitch would be built on a giant, wheeled, concrete tray 40 cm deep, 80 m wide and 120 m long, making it easy to roll the playing surface at the touch of a button through the stands and out to the side of the stadium where it will double as a park complete with water feature for local residents.

The other bidders for the Kings Dock site were:

French consortium - Vouyguese - which built the Stad de France in Paris and was involved in the construction of the Channel Tunnel.

A newly formed consortium, including construction giant AMEC and British Waterways.

North Star Consortium, led by Fiortho the company currently building luxury waterfront flats next to the Kings Dock site.

Chester-based Leisure development specialists THI - builders of the new multiplex at Cheshire Oaks and a number of hotels in the region.

Commercial developers and homebuilders Wilson Bowden UK.




Here you will find a detailed analysis of the project including timeline from tofeeweb.com that is well worth looking at.



Pictures:







Heres a high res pic of the stadium.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
18,269 Posts
Going to Kirkby would still be keeping EFC in the city, they would just get their bins emptied by someone other than the city corpy...let's get that point clear, cuts all the city of 450k population crap... but!

There should be huge resintance to taking EFC to an edge city site, no good for the club and definitely no good for the city... things like this should be in the inner core.


Downtown stadia do not provide massive dividends sometimes claimed, but simply taking the Millennium stadium as an example shows the massive extra value of getting 50, 70 or 80k extra people downtown than would otherwise be the case. it is proven that edge city stadia visitors usually drive tothe venue, watch the event then **** off.. putting no money into local coffers.



My prefared choice would be for both clubs to share a stadium... paint the seats green and call it St (San or even Santa for the really pretentious) Domingo and bang... a **** off 85k arena that neither club could do on their own.

Sadly this won't happen. What ever the eventual solution is EFC must move to or adjacent to the central docks... surrounded by a super high density district of towers (to make up for the land uptake a big arena would do) that linked inland with scottie/Everton and downtown!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
We'll decide on stadium this year:
Feb 17 2006
By Neil Hodgson, Liverpool Echo
www.icliverpool.co.uk

THE FUTURE for Everton's stadium will be known by the end of this year. That was the pledge from club chief executive Keith Wyness last night.

In an audience-style forum with members of private sector lobby group Downtown Liverpool in Business at Goodison Park, he outlined the three options open to the club in its bid to develop a state-of-the-art ground.
And he vowed: "By the end of this year we will have a big move forward on something."

Answering questions from the audience, he virtually ruled out a shared ground with rivals Liverpool or redeveloping their current Goodison home. That leaves building their own ground the most likely outcome.
He said Liverpool bosses David Moores and Rick Parry are not keen on sharing grounds, commenting: "Over their dead bodies, I think they said."
He added: "Redeveloping Goodison will be difficult financially, not being able to generate naming rights."

Of the three options facing the club, he admitted: "Our own stadium is probably the furthest advanced."

The ECHO revealed on Monday that property giant Peel Holdings had approached Everton with an offer to build them a ground at Switch Island.
Mr Wyness confirmed: "Switch Island is one of these options, but developers come to us all the time. "I am listening to everyone, but the key thing is realistic delivery. If you make the decision, you are stuck with it for 50 or 60 years."
And he hinted the club may prefer not to own a new ground: "Leaseback is one possible formula. Another is forming a stadium company to build it and we pay a management fee and would never own it, just lease it."


He also indicated finance might not be as much a hurdle now. Yesterday Everton was named for the first time in the top 20 world clubs in turnover and he said: "We are a different club compared with a year or so ago. We think the bank would probably lend money to us rather than the team across the park."
 

·
Fugly
Joined
·
11,311 Posts
That's a point I don't get. Liverpool want 70k, Everton want 50-60k. Share a ground and have 85k? What would be the point of having a ground that big if it were only filled on derby day?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Everton offered move to Kirkby:
May 31 2006
by Sam Lister Daily Post Staff


KNOWSLEY council has offered Everton FC three prime development sites on which to build a new stadium.
Executives at the local authority are involved in a sustained attempt to tempt the club out of Liverpool to the Kirkby area.
Kirkby's municipal golf course is one of the sites the club have been offered, along with nearby land next to Kirkby sports centre on Valley Road, both close to motorway access from the M57.

It is believed Knowsley would provide the land needed either free or at a much reduced rate, so keen are they to attract a prestige deal which would prove a massive boost to the area's economy and reputation.
Cheap land and the possibility of the council accessing regeneration grants for work in and around the new stadium will be a major inducement for Everton, with the financing of the project still a major hurdle for the club to overcome.

Last night, a spokesman for Everton confirmed: "There are talks ongoing. We have a number of options." It is believed the former Cronton Colliery had also been put forward initially, but was dismissed.
The club is now considering using that plot for a new training academy for coaches, if it can secure the finances once their stadium plans have been finalised.


The Everton board has been approached with a number of sites since the collapse of the Kings Dock project in February, 2003.
Other options include land at Switch Island and a site in Speke.

A spokeswoman for Knowsley council said: "The council under-stands Kirkby is one of a number of options being considered by Everton FC at this stage."

Liverpool Council is keen to ensure the club stays in the city and officials are sure to be busy working behind the scenes to try to match any deals offered by its neighbouring local authority.
The club has still not officially committed itself to leaving Goodison Park, its home since 1892, but will make a formal announcement this summer.

Officials insist it is still considering plans for redeveloping the current ground or ground-sharing with Liverpool FC, although these are both now highly unlikely options.
Late last year, chief executive Keith Wyness was in talks with financial experts about funding a 50,000-capacity stadium costing around £125m.

Everton's financial position has improved in the past 12 months, giving Mr Wyness renewed confidence that a new stadium is again a valid option. In November, Everton announced the best financial results in the club's 127-year history. Turnover rose by 34% from £44.7m last year to £60m.

Everton secured a place in the Deloitte and Touche top 20 world club rich-list for the first time, and finishing fourth in the Premiership brought a greater slice of prize money, with greater revenue from live televised games.
Profit after player trading showed a turnaround of £38.9m, from a loss of £15.4m to a profit of £23.5m.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
18,269 Posts
No Bunnyman, Inter can't fill the San Siro on thier own... without coming up with really imaginiative ideas as to how to up the gate... something EFC and particularly LFC have not even begun to consider. LFC sits on its arse as it fills the ground every week... EFC is still too close to capacity to need really innovative ideas to fill it.


With a bigger ground than either could fill on thier own with current tactics introduces all sorts of opportunities for the city to greatly expand football tourist breaks and longer holiday packages, family and adult/child packages could be much more generous than now... why, they may even consider lowering the prices to get the bums on seats!

With a bigger ground all sorts of possibilities arise... but then this is Liverpool!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Council will fight to keep Blues in our city:
May 31 2006
By Nick Coligan & Sam Lister, Liverpool Echo


COUNCIL leader Warren Bradley today vowed to "fight tooth and nail" to stop Everton FC leaving Liverpool.

Experts have been sent out by the council to scour the city for potential sites for a new stadium, after it emerged Knowsley was offering the club three possible plots including land next to Kirkby sports centre in Valley Road.
Reports that Kirkby municipal golf course - owned by Liverpool council - was also being offered to Everton were today denied by Knowsley chiefs.
It is thought the Knowsley offers would see the space being provided free or cheaply to attract the club.

But Liverpool council is desperate to come up with its own sites within the city boundaries, and has not ruled out resurrecting a ground-share with Liverpool FC. The Reds have repeatedly said that is not an option.


Cllr Bradley, an Everton season ticket holder, said: "We have got land development services looking at available sites in the city, in south as well as north Liverpool.
"Everton chief executive Keith Wyness knows we are doing that and has not told me that they have plans to move anywhere else.
"We have also not yet discounted a joint stadium because Liverpool have not yet given a definite 'yes' to the new Anfield, and if there is a change of hierarchy, it could be back on the agenda.
"If Everton did leave, the knock-on effect would really be felt in Walton."

Labour opposition leader Joe Anderson, also a Blue, added: "The council must be more proactive and talk to neighbouring authorities to see if we can broker some sort of deal."

Speculation about Everton's future at Goodison Park has been rife since a plan for a waterfront stadium at Kings Dock collapsed more than three years ago.

The ECHO revealed last year that a site off Switch Island, Netherton, was also being considered by the club, while Liverpool's Central Docks have also been mentioned.

An Everton spokesman said: "There are talks ongoing. We have a number of options."
 

·
Fugly
Joined
·
11,311 Posts
Footy for a fiver could work. 40,000 season tickets, 20,000 £15 matchday tickets, 20,000 £5 matchday tickets and 15,000 premium seats for the prawn sandwich brigade etc. If you could get enough bums on seats, with the majority of money coming from the toffs and pie/booze sales then it might just be viable as a joint stadium.

If you had the food outlets and pubs bars that sold goods at a reasonable price in the ground, then all the money that would go down County Rd on a matchday would go directly into the clubs coffers instead. So much for the Peoples' club eh?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
CENTRAL DOCKS?: Economist calls for joint waterfront venture
Jun 2 2004
By Larry Neild, Daily Post


LIVERPOOL and Everton should share an iconic stadium on Liverpool's famous waterfront, a leading university economist has said in a report.

Peter Stoney, a University of Liverpool academic and lecturer, is calling for the stadium to be built on a brownfield site within the Central Docks system, not far from the Stanley Heritage Market.
He makes an economic case for the dockland site in preference to Liverpool FC's plans for a new stadium in Stanley Park.

Although his report proposes a stadium for Liverpool FC, he goes one stage further and says a shared ground with Everton would be even better for the city's economy. It would, he says, be the UK's first shared ground and would enable both clubs to:

Play in a stadium with a world-class design;

Enable both clubs to share costs and overheads, guaranteeing affordable ticket prices;

Spend more money on their playing squads;

Become a major tourist attraction in its own right;

Provide a world-class facility for Capital of Culture events in 2008;

Allow public funders to offer better support to a joint project of regional importance with major economic benefit.


Mr Stoney also says a shared stadium on the 73-acre site would show how Liverpool as a city can overcome old rivalries for the mutual benefit of the area.

He also says the removal of the two stadiums from their present locations can be compensated with developments such as Anfield Plaza, supermarkets and residential developments, helped by the growing demand for inner-city living.

"The Central Docks site provides the best fit with local and national planning policies and, being a brownfield estate, is more suited to stadium development than Stanley Park," said Mr Stoney.

"Compared with Stanley Park and other locations the waterfront site and scale of the estate can be expected to create more jobs, more revenue generating opportunities and higher value-mixed use development within an immediate area of some of the most deprived communities in the UK."

He says transport links to the Pier Head, city centre, and airport can expect to ensure a much wider economic benefit for the whole of Merseyside from having a stadium at Central Docks.

"The main environmental benefit is an avoidance of the need for Liverpool FC to move on to around 30% of Stanley Park in order to build a new stadium. The main socio-economic benefits are associated with relieving deprivation amongst local communities most in need."

In addition, says Stoney, there are significant, positive income and employment effects for the city's redevelopment which would not accrue to the same degree with the Stanley Park proposal.

Mr Stoney says LFC's preferred option involves a significant incursion on to Stanley Park, at the same time creating a high-quality public realm space called Anfield Plaza, together with a new village centre on Anfield/ Breckfield.

"The proposal is hotly disputed by local community groups who wish Stanley Park to be preserved and enhanced in its existing form."

Mr Stoney says the Anfield Plaza and Breckfield village projects could still go ahead without a Stanley Park stadium.

A spokesman for the Mersey Docks and Harbour Company said: "Central Docks is a site of strategic importance for Merseyside with the potential to create major regeneration benefits for the city and beyond. There is also powerful appeal in the development of a world-class stadium in a world-class location.

"Any stadium project is likely to require some public funding, and clearly the city and development agencies will need to ensure their ultimate choice achieves maximum regeneration impact.

"If another location is deemed to more readily satisfy all criteria, then we can take comfort in the knowledge that developer interest in the Central Docks site is already very strong and the location presents a range of exciting, alternative uses."


A new stadium in the Central Docks system on a site north of Waterloo Warehouse and south of Collingwood Dock.

A new railway station is proposed within walking distance of the stadium.

Major heritage buildings within Central Docks would be enhanced with complementary world class architecture.

The waterfront location with extended opening hours would attract substantially more tourists than Stanley Park.

Non-match day income would be boosted through increased merchandising.

The closeness of the Old Hall Street/Central Business district would mean a greater flow of corporate entertainment and sales of premium seating.

A 1,000-place car park could be built under the stadium.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
bluesnapper said:
Cue John MK.............................................................
LOL!!!

Speaking of whom........(!)

John will disagree strongly with this, but the more I think about it the more I would like to see the stadium built on Central Docks.

Whilst (after a bit of a re-think) I agreed with John that a stadium at Kings Dock would have been a disaster. I believe it could work on Central Docks as the area is (correct me if i'm wrong) much larger and is easier to get people in and out of in comparison to the smaller and narrower Kings Dock.

I think it would suitable there for the reasons given by the economist mentioned above and because i'd like to see, for sentimental reasons, Everton on the banks of the royal blue Mersey....as opposed to moving towards the outskirts/Kirkby.

Heres an interesting design that was suggested in 2003 that i hadn't seen before today that I really like the sound of........................

from icliverpool:


EVERTON are in talks over a new 60,000-seat stadium on the banks of the River Mersey.

Developers have approached the club with £500m project which would see the Blues move to the Central Docks - next to the Stanley Dock warehouse to the north of the city. The new docks scheme has been put together by urban regeneration expert David Taylor and involves some of the world's bigest names in design and construction.

Taylor has devised a massive facelift on the derelict docks area north of Waterloo Dock and has already held talks with Everton chief executive Michael Dunford and hopes to make a more detailed presentation to the club board within a fortnight.

Mr Taylor is a former boss of Lancashire Enterprises and sits on the board of Preston North End football club. He first came to prominence as a judge on Tony Wilson's Flying Start TV show for small businesses.

He said: "This started out as a fall back for Liverpool FC in case their plans to move to Stanley Park fell through, but now they are committed to that we are now dealing with Everton after the collapse of their Kings Dock plans.
"We have met Michael Dunford and hope to meet the board in the next couple of weeks."


His plan is a mixed-use scheme, including residential, leisure, pubs and bars and a dedicated train station on the nearby Northern Line close to the listed Stanley Dock warehouse. "We would bring people through the Stanley Dock area, about four minutes away from the ground," he said.
"The total cost will be about £500m and we're talking to Everton about whether theirs will be a lease arrangement or they will own the stadium."

He added: "Central Dock is far better than Kings Dock because we can put a new rail link in and there are plenty of park and ride spaces there, too. It's also far enough away not to interfere with the city's retail areas and relatively close to Everton's existing home."

His Preston-based David Taylor Partners consultancy is working with Liverpool developer Inner City Solutions, which has helped regenerate Speke Garston and Japanese company Kajima who are renowned for their sports stadia.

"Our architects are NBDJ Architects who are probably the world's leading designers at the moment. They have just finished the Philadelphia Eagles stadium which will open with its first game in August between Manchester United and Barcelona," said Mr Taylor.

He said the proposed Everton ground would seat between 55,000 and 60,000 and, unlike the Kings Dock scheme, does not have a sliding pitch or roof: "It is a football stadium," he added.

He said he has also held talks on his proposals with land owner Mersey Docks and Harbour Company and English Partnerships.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
16 Posts
Evertonian said:
LOL!!!
John will disagree strongly with this, but the more I think about it the more I would like to see the stadium built on Central Docks.

Whilst (after a bit of a re-think) I agreed with John that a stadium at Kings Dock would have been a disaster. I believe it could work on Central Docks as the area is (correct me if i'm wrong) much larger and is easier to get people in and out of in comparison to the smaller and narrower Kings Dock.
The Central Docks site is on Clarence Dock - filled in, in 1927. The site borders the Dock Road, as opposed to the Kings Dock which has water on both sides. You may as well build the stadium on or over the Dock Road rather than on Clarence dock itself - which should be excavated and re-instated with suitable apartment buildings to re-vitalise the area.

A large stadium there is just plain out of place and out of character.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,318 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
KIRKBY ENTHUSIASM: whenskiesaregrey.com
By mark o'brien
Date: 31/5/2006
www.whenskiesaregrey.com

"It was just an excuse to use the title really, nothing more. Cue the annoying theme tune.


Stadium move stories are normally the preserve of proper slow news days. When there's not even an update on Andy van der Meyde's fitness.

However, on the day that Andy Johnson was 'unveiled' - which suggests he starts in a box with a curtain over it, like Debbie Magee - there is crazy talk about Everton being offered primo real estate, just off that there M57, to build a new home. Hey, if we're signing England internationals ahead of Wigan and Bolton then it's time to ruddy well reach for the stars.

Knowsley Council are said to be much keen on having the Blues build a stadium within their boundaries, and are even offering Kirkby Golf Course, Peter Johnson's favoured site when all this originally kicked off so many moons ago. How could you forget those artist's impressions of couples linking arms and strolling along the majestic boulevards that swept down towards the Copplehouse?

Everton are said to be looking at loads of sites, but the thought of that one, with it's good motorway links and the added incentives of the land being apparently dead cheap and all sorts of them murky grants available, by all accounts, has got to be particularly tempting. Certainly better than Switch Bastard Island as 'Sally Traffic' should refer to Maghull's favourite traffic blackspot.

Anyway, that's still all the usual pie in the sky - if we've learnt anything it's to believe nothing about new grounds until the day we turn up at Goodison on a Saturday and there is a sign made out of a Walker's Crisps box in the ticket office window saying 'NOW AT NEW PREMISSES' and a big arrow.

Elsewhere, in real news, Johnson was 'paraded' and our Mr Moyes got all bullish and started talking about another signing on the horizon sooner rather than later. The big ginger tease."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,349 Posts
Forgot to ask this on the numerous other John MK threads, but can he, or someone else, confirm or deny that he has land in the Baltic Triangle?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
461 Posts
I personally thought the 'sail boat' design (above) was pretty turd. Do agree with Sebo about Stadia should be in the city. I have been to Melbourne a few times (one of my fave cities in the world) the MCG is in the city as too is the Dock Land's stadium. **** it, I think we should have an MCG stadium for Everton, just a thought.
 
1 - 20 of 126 Posts
Top