Grayling suggests replacing local bus services

1623 Views 5 Replies 5 Participants Last post by damo_, Dec 17, 2017

mr_jrt

Discussion Starter · Dec 16, 2017

Can't see this going down well.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...replaced-by-uber-style-services-says-grayling

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The thing is that he's not actually wrong. What he's describing is like a glorified Dial a Bus scheme, which could be much better for rural communities than a less frequent scheduled bus service. Using smartphones (and other internet technology, like Amazon Echo) to schedule pickups through an automated system is far more efficient than phoning up a human and getting them to adjust a schedule manually. The buses don't have to be driverless - they just need to have some way of re-routing the driver whenever someone needs picked up along the route. Uber already offer actual ride sharing for reduced fares, so the technology exists today to make this feasible.

In denser environments like cities it'll still be more efficient to run traditional bus services, albeit with some possibility of efficiency tweaks. The real change is for places which couldn't provide efficient public transport today for any reasonable amount of subsidy. What ultimately matters is whether people can get to the places they need to go, for some reasonable amount of money and in some reasonable amount of time, and there's no reason why we shouldn't leverage technology to make that happen.

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Mr Cladding

· #3 · Dec 16, 2017

I think the controversy is around, how this would affect older people. They not likely to call for an Uber and are more accustomed to digging out their printed timetable and catching the bus.

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Vulcan's Finest

· #4 · Dec 16, 2017

1M14 said:
The thing is that he's not actually wrong. What he's describing is like a glorified Dial a Bus scheme, which could be much better for rural communities than a less frequent scheduled bus service. Using smartphones (and other internet technology, like Amazon Echo) to schedule pickups through an automated system is far more efficient than phoning up a human and getting them to adjust a schedule manually. The buses don't have to be driverless - they just need to have some way of re-routing the driver whenever someone needs picked up along the route. Uber already offer actual ride sharing for reduced fares, so the technology exists today to make this feasible.

In denser environments like cities it'll still be more efficient to run traditional bus services, albeit with some possibility of efficiency tweaks. The real change is for places which couldn't provide efficient public transport today for any reasonable amount of subsidy. What ultimately matters is whether people can get to the places they need to go, for some reasonable amount of money and in some reasonable amount of time, and there's no reason why we shouldn't leverage technology to make that happen.

Personally I think driverless taxis (hybrid or electric) with 4/5 seats will be the true game changer for urban mobility - also it will reduce the need for many individuals in cities to actually own a vehicle. The major part of a taxi fare after all is the payment to the driver rather than the capital and running costs. It might be possible for such vehicles to offer journeys at as low a rate as 30p a mile (depending on utilization). And of course multiple user autonomous mini-buses seating 7-12 could easily replace less frequent traditional bus services on popular routes.

Grayling wasn't wrong as such, but his message delivery leaves a lot to be desired. You do get the feeling he isn't one for looking at complex things like this in great depth.

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1M14

· #5 · Dec 16, 2017

Mr Cladding said:
I think the controversy is around, how this would affect older people. They not likely to call for an Uber and are more accustomed to digging out their printed timetable and catching the bus.

However, I brought up the example of Dial-a-Bus. Old and disabled people are the primary users of this sort of service, so the basic notion of a demand-based bus service isn't that outlandish. If their usage is going to be predictable, like it is for most Dial-a-Bus services, the system can automatically schedule their journeys. If other users are more comfortable scheduling journeys at shorter notice, then this will be possible too.

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damo_

· #6 · Dec 17, 2017

1M14 said:
However, I brought up the example of Dial-a-Bus. Old and disabled people are the primary users of this sort of service, so the basic notion of a demand-based bus service isn't that outlandish. If their usage is going to be predictable, like it is for most Dial-a-Bus services, the system can automatically schedule their journeys. If other users are more comfortable scheduling journeys at shorter notice, then this will be possible too.

Where i grew up there was a bus every two hours, run by a single bus taking about 50 minutes out, waiting ten then returning. The route was tortuos as it served half a dozen villages on the off chance. It seldom had more than 4 or 5 people on it. I could see this being way better. Same resource just a dial and go, first come first served.

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