Kochi | Discussions

sakrishna said:

But people have really got fed up with CPM because, while the leaders of the so called people's party are intelligently making money (by dirty means), those who actually follow the principles of the party are made to work like donkeys and don't enjoy any benefit.

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How are they making money and where is the party workers money? Party leaders doesnt have much investments in coperative firms and party channels. Most of money is coming from investors - small and large. Even MPs and MLAs have to give a part of the salary to party funds. Thats why party workers are not fighting for positions. This is how party is getting money. They also collect money from public. This is one of the reason Abdullakutty quoted against party while joining COngress. Once he also said that.

Who gave you these info ? Please furnish the proofs for it. Even CBI didnt able to find any evidence that Pinarayi got money from SNC lavalin. Is there any other case or allegations against party leaders like Bofors case, Spectrum Allocation case, Haj Quota Scam, Pamolin Case, Edamalayar case etc etc ?

Arunpr, thanks for the clarifications. this is not the forum, and I have no interest in discussing party politics or ideology. So I will pass that.

I was away from Kakkanad for the early half of this decade. But what I know is that when Kinfra park was being set up, companies were DENIED permission to set up IT operations in favour of Technopark. When that (stupid) policy changed, companies started thronging to the area. That included DIC.

Now, there is no point in talking about all those. Let us focus on the Smart City problem.

Let me summarize what I gather from your previous posts.

1. The UDF leaders wanted to give undue favours to DIC, while they set up an IT park here

2. The leaders were expecting to get huge bribes in return.

3. The LDF re-negotiated the terms to their satisfaction, since they were not expecting any kickback, resulting in the framework agreement that is published at the GoK website (that you posted here)

If you agree that these are your basis points, we can debate on the further issues.

^^:lol: Seems like you are good at writing fictitious stuff. Just show the proof that the Govt arm twisted IT comps to start operations at Technopark. If you can't do that just stop bringing in Technopark in the discussion. :bash:

DileepKS said:

Hmm, in 2002, the only thing at Kakkanad was Kusumagiri? That shows how well informed you are.

I know for a fact (not speculation, FACT) that the government was actively promoting Technopark those days. Companies who wanted to set up shop in CEPZ (because of the VSNL Gateway) were strongly discouraged and packed off to Technopark. IT development was 'permitted' only after Technopark attained some kind of critical mass. When development did come, it took off well, and it is no wonder that it attracted world wide interest, including TECOM's.

And your speculation that Ummen Chandy (BTW, I reported your post for twisting the name to a vulgar and derogatory term, not that I expect anything out of it) and Kunhalikutty were going to get crores have the same validity of my speculation that the current stalemate is because of the question of how to share the same crores between your comrade leaders.

Both speculation. No proof. Oh, I forgot. Our dear comrade leaders can't do any evil, while those dirty politicians are neck deep in it. Same tactics of the great paper that informs the truth early.

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rajkrish said:

^^:lol: Seems like you are good at writing fictitious stuff. Just show the proof that the Govt arm twisted IT comps to start operations at Technopark. If you can't do that just stop bringing in Technopark in the discussion. :bash:

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Proof? How can one prove something that was verbally told? I don't know if there was a Govt Order or anything on that, but the answer I got from my bosses, and from the VSNL folk at the gateway was exactly that. It was common knowledge among the circle that time.

We've also heard stuff like this. how Wipro was forced to take up space in Infopark and how CTS was arm twisted to take up space in Technopolis. We even heard a Satyam official blasting Govt for having been told to go to Kochi when they asked for space in TVM. :lol:

DileepKS said:

Proof? How can one prove something that was verbally told? I don't know if there was a Govt Order or anything on that, but the answer I got from my bosses, and from the VSNL folk at the gateway was exactly that. It was common knowledge among the circle that time.

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rajkrish said:

We've also heard stuff like this. how Wipro was forced to take up space in Infopark and how CTS was arm twisted to take up space in Technopolis. We even heard a Satyam official blasting Govt for having been told to go to Kochi when they asked for space in TVM. :lol:

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That may be true. Policies change from time to time.

I mentioned the point because ArunPR seemed to imply that the IT development at Kakkanad was brought in artificially to 'sell the land' to DIC in early 2000s. That is not true.

DileepKS said:

Arunpr, thanks for the clarifications. this is not the forum, and I have no interest in discussing party politics or ideology. So I will pass that.

I was away from Kakkanad for the early half of this decade. But what I know is that when Kinfra park was being set up, companies were DENIED permission to set up IT operations in favour of Technopark. When that (stupid) policy changed, companies started thronging to the area. That included DIC.

Now, there is no point in talking about all those. Let us focus on the Smart City problem.

Let me summarize what I gather from your previous posts.

1. The UDF leaders wanted to give undue favours to DIC, while they set up an IT park here

2. The leaders were expecting to get huge bribes in return.

3. The LDF re-negotiated the terms to their satisfaction, since they were not expecting any kickback, resulting in the framework agreement that is published at the GoK website (that you posted here)

If you agree that these are your basis points, we can debate on the further issues.

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I agree with your points.

In my opinion, IT investments doesnt mean Smart City. I dont think Smart City can able to attract much companies to Kochi. DIC itself has one of the worlds highest rental rates in IT space. Mostly, It will be the same case with Smart City also. Kochi can attract IT companies only if we can give IT space for less rates than in Bangalore/Hyderabad/Chennai.

Govt should give land for lease to IT companies to start operations. Also govt should try to bring more companies to Infopark. Once they start operations in Infopark, govt can give land future expansions. More efforts are required from the side of government. Govt has to follow the path of AK Antony and assure them more sops.

In Electronics City Bangalore, Infosys, Wipro and HP have got huge campuses. Major chunks of jobs are created by them. Govt can easily expand Infopark in the lines of Electronics City or Technopark Trivandrum.

Also keralites working in big IT companies also need to play a big role to bring more companies to Kerala. There are many people who are working in the senior levels. But they have a very bad impression about kerala, which is created by media. This has to change.

Kochi or Kakkanad area has got lot of advantages. Around 1500 acres of land is present in Kakkanad and Brahmapuram areas [Including the land with FACT]. So govt should use this land for IT parks and develop Infopark with the support of private investors. Govt doesnt need to acquire any land for this like the Technocity Trivandrum. This area has got a very good connectivity from all the places like Nedumbassery, Muvattupuzha, Perumbavoor, Ernakulam Town, NH47, NH49, NH17 etc etc. So there will not be much traffic issues. People can stay in any of the nearby towns like Perumbavoor, Kalamassery, Aluva, Muvattupuzha, Thodupuzha, Cherthala, Angamaly and they can easily commute to Infopark.

Well, if the DIC is so evil, unviable and unaffordable, then why didn't the LDF govt kick them out in the beginning? Why did they sign the framework agreement that includes the clause for 'freehold'?

And yes, the blame on media. Sure! Everything is media creation onlee saar! As usual, you are thinking 20 years behind. This would have worked 20 years ago.

Do you REALLY think much of your own cadres believe that BS?

DileepKS said:

Well, if the DIC is so evil, unviable and unaffordable, then why didn't the LDF govt kick them out in the beginning? Why did they sign the framework agreement that includes the clause for 'freehold'?

And yes, the blame on media. Sure! Everything is media creation onlee saar! As usual, you are thinking 20 years behind. This would have worked 20 years ago.

Do you REALLY think much of your own cadres believe that BS?

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I am not telling that DIC is evil. DIC could able to attract only 10000 jobs in Dubai Internet City in 10 years, which is almost same as the current strength of Infopark Kochi. Govt is expecting TECOM to do a better job than Infopark Kochi. Thats why govt signed an agreement with TECOM. But they couldnt able to do anything in the last 3 years, after signing the agreement. TECOM couldnt able to attract any major company to Malta Smaty City also. Thats why govt is planning to look for other investors. Govt is sceptical about the financial and execution capabilities of TECOM. In 2007, govt had other options too. But the discussions with TECOM was at final stages and it was easy for govt to ink an agreement with TECOM.

In my opinion, companies like RMZ, Embassy, ASCENDAS, Prestige etc have better capability than TECOM. They have prooved that too.

Govt doesnt want to do everything by its own. Thats why govt signed an agreement with TECOM to build Smart City in Kochi.

Why TECOM is so adamant about 12% free holding ?
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My assumptions.

TECOM has already spent around 105 crores(In that around 100 crores for land) for Smart City Kochi.They spent lot of money for the first phase of Malta Smart City too. Now TECOM might need to mortage this land to get more money from investors in Arab countries. They dont have money with them to proceed further. This could be the reason why they are asking for free holding and selling rights.

Govts stand is, If TECOM want to do this, they have to buy land and contruct Smart City like the HDIL Cyber City. HDIL bought land for 200 crores. If govt give special exemptions for TECOM, then people might go to court against the govts move as the HDIL case. In the agreement it is clear that TECOM has to complete the master plan and then only govt can give free holding.

How will govt identify the free holding ? It is not possible for govt to give free holding in some area.
Govt has given the land for cheap lease rate. It is less than the lease rates in Kinfra. As per the agreement, TECOM will surely get more benefits than RMZ and other players.

DileepKS said:

I was away from Kakkanad for the early half of this decade. But what I know is that when Kinfra park was being set up, companies were DENIED permission to set up IT operations in favour of Technopark. When that (stupid) policy changed, companies started thronging to the area. That included DIC.

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Same will the case for TCS also.

TCS asked for 50 acres of land in Infopark for a development centre in 2005 itself. Govt gave land in Technopark and now the development centre is almost finished. Later govt gave only 14 acres of land in Infopark, Kochi.

DileepKS said:

I was away from Kakkanad for the early half of this decade. But what I know is that when Kinfra park was being set up, companies were DENIED permission to set up IT operations in favour of Technopark. When that (stupid) policy changed, companies started thronging to the area. That included DIC.

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Boss, I was with KINFRA in business development in (2001-2002). It was the Kinfra Information Technology & Electronics Park (KITEL) which was christened as INFOPARK later. Nobody had denied permission to set up operations from that Park.

I had worked with Technopark also later (2002-2003). WIPRO who had come to Technopark and was requested to take space in Infopark by the Govt since Infosys had alreay taken space in Technopark. We have later seen the press releases by the Satyam guy (I forgot his name, can dig out his name if reqd) also on similar grounds when they were requested to move to Infopark. Infact I was with him when he was responding to one of the media houses over the issue.

So there is no need to put the blame on 'Technopark' promotion.

arunpr said:

Same will the case for TCS also.

TCS asked for 50 acres of land in Infopark for a development centre in 2005 itself. Govt gave land in Technopark and now the development centre is almost finished. Later govt gave only 14 acres of land in Infopark, Kochi.

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Same here too. I have been seeing the first TCS facility in Technopark, (Training Centre) from late 1990s itself. It was later expanded as 'PEEPUL PARK', the global training centre in about 50 acres. This has happened before the request for land in Infopark. In Technopark too TCS had sought 14 acres for Development Centre. Just as in Infopark, they had been allotted the same in Technopark. Now, TCS is about the start the construction of the development centre in the 14 acres SEZ. (Tata Realty is the PMC & Shapoorji Pallonji are the contractors).

DileepKS said:

Sudheesh, I assume you know/guess where my information comes from. .

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Dileep, I think I know a brief outline of your curriculum vitae…Your stint overseas as well as your present company.

Probably the KITEL started after the policy change.

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No, KITEL was started prior to 2000.

There was no ‘policy’ earlier too favouring Technopark which got later changed. The LDF had initiated Technopark first then moved on to other district level industrial and IT parks. During their time they had somewhat neutral approach to all regions/parks. I could see the clear change when UDF got in to power (I think it was in 2002). It was very well evident from the actions of Kunhalikutty. Govt started pushing ‘Infopark’ from then. I myself has seen letters from Minister’s Office urging the need for promoting Kochi & Infopark. There is nothing wrong in promoting any park or any region, but it was like turning the head away from a facility which was getting critical mass and being noticed. Many new initiatives were announced in Kochi, ‘IT Corridor’ along Sea-port Airport Road, HI Tech City at Kalamassery etc. I had participated in trade shows, like India International Trade Fair in Delhi, with the models of those parks while the mention/participation of Technopark was not there.

Technopark at that time was going good with Mr. Rajiv Vasudevan, who was one of the most capable CEOs Technopark had seen. It was he who took the courage to get loans from banks for the construction of ‘Bhavani’. It was during his time Technopark got its critical mass, also MNCs like Ernst & Young, Mckinsey, Alliance Cornhill etc set up shop. He had maintained good relations with all companies and it was just like any other corporate CEO, he had been instrumental in the formation of Group Of Technopark Companies (GTECH), which provided a platform for all the companies to come together and work in tandem with Park Centre (Technopark). He was too ‘Corporate’ to adjust to our Govt settings and he became a ‘pain in the neck’ for many and finally he resigned. As I have mentioned earlier, I have the first hand information of the Govt’s request to Wipro to take space in Infopark and not in Technopark.

COCHIN

GOVERNMENT IS UNDERESTIMATING COCHIN DEVELOPMENT....TECHNOPARK
THE MAIN SIGN OF TAT S POSTPONING OF SMART CITY...
AND ALSO IF SMART CITY IS STARTED, MANY COMPANIES WILL ATTRACTED TO COCHIN AND THEREFORE TECHNOPARK MAY GO DOWN
IN THE BUDGET TOO THEY GAVE 950CR FOR TECHNOPARK ,BUT ONLY 250 FOR INFOPARK
THANKS

sudheeshnairs said:

As I have mentioned earlier, I have the first hand information of the Govt’s request to Wipro to take space in Infopark and not in Technopark.

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Well, I have 'reliable second hand' (ie, the my boss heard it, and told me) information on what I said. We will know the truth when Aruna Sundarraj writes her service story. Let us agree to disagree right now.

Smart City - Cites TECOM's demand for freehold land as reason for stalemate

Cites TECOM's demand for freehold land as reason for stalemate

THIRUVANANTHAPPURAM: Registration Minister S. Sarma, who is also chairman of SmartCity Kochi, has said that the promoter TECOM's demand for the inclusion of a provision in the lease deed for allowing it the right of sale of 12 per cent of the land of the project area is responsible for the present problem.

In a clarification issued here on Tuesday, in the context of what he described as the smokescreen being created over the issue by the Opposition with political motives, the Minister said TECOM made the demand only at the time when the lease deed had to be re-registered due to technical reasons.

The technical reasons given out by him were as follows: The framework agreement was for declaring the entire area consisting of 246 acres of the project as Special Economic Zone (SEZ). The company wanted the entire area to be declared as one SEZ and the State recommended accordingly to the Centre. But the Centre did not do so as a river flowed there. That was why only 131 acres was declared as SEZ. The government subsequently removed all obstacles in the way of declaring the remaining area also as SEZ.

The lease deed for the transfer of land had been prepared and submitted for registration way back in 2007. But at the time or registration, the company raised a dispute over stamp duty. The State government thereupon exempted it in the larger interest of the project. At that time, in order to abide by the provisions of the Registration Act, the first lease deed had to be re-registered. It was at that juncture that TECOM demanded the inclusion of the provision which was not there in the first agreement.

The agreement made it clear that the entire 246 acres would be SEZ area. The law did not permit grant of right of sale in a SEZ area. The agreement did not say anywhere that freehold would be given with right of sale outside SEZ. That was why the government took the stand against allowing right of sale.

http://www.hindu.com/2010/03/31/stories/2010033153040500.htm