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I believe the scientists and engineers have this one covered with a new invention called... The Ramp.
What sort of gradient are you predicting such a ramp would need? Or are we talking about a staggered San Francisco style ramp? Or how about one really long one the whole length of Collin Stret?
 

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Or how about one really long one the whole length of Collin Stret?
Just like the one which is already there you mean? :angel:

The levels round there are never going to be kind - make the whole outdoor space at canal street level and Middle Hill will be made even steeper than it already is as the upper level is fixed due to the tram and you'd be pushing the start of it back and requiring more demolition of the Broadmarsh and rebuilding of the service yard access. At which point we are in the realm of Intu procrastinating for another 20 years, while making the public route towards the Lace Market less pleasant than it already is!
 

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I'm not sold that sort of thing is the answer to the problem at all.

The answer would be (and hopefully one day will be) to get rid of Tanner's Walk altogether, but to do such a thing would rely on the development of the shopping centre, car park/bus station and Collin Street to be designed from the ground-up as one. Again.
 

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Yes, razing it all to the ground and starting again would have been by far the best solution but much more expensive.

Building some steps and moving the cinema entrance to provide animation onto Collin Street would surely have been possible within the existing budgets.
 

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Yes, razing it all to the ground and starting again would have been by far the best solution but much more expensive.

Building some steps and moving the cinema entrance to provide animation onto Collin Street would surely have been possible within the existing budgets.
I'm not sure I'm fully understanding what you're saying here - I get that you want shop frontages on Collin Street, but in order to have entrances to these at the same level as the mall they'd have to be stepped down (to entrances which would be below sight level)? Doesn't seem like a very desirable frontage.

Or are you saying you'd prefer the frontages to align with the 1st floor of the mall, with the Berlin Wall converted in to a solid streetlength of stairs? Or just stairways up to each frontage? Or some sort of external walkway with steps leading up that (but nothing beneath)?

Sorry if I'm coming across as obtuse, but all those ideas seem no better than what is currently planned to me, and would perhaps look worse if those units fail to let (as many expect might be a problem...)
 

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with the Berlin Wall converted in to a solid streetlength of stairs?
No, if you design level changes into the pedestrianisation of Collin Street, you don't need to build individual flights of stairs at a series of doorways. Instead, you integrate ramps, stairs and slopes into the design of the street.
 

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No, if you design level changes into the pedestrianisation of Collin Street, you don't need to build individual flights of stairs at a series of doorways. Instead, you integrate ramps, stairs and slopes into the design of the street.
But isn't there stuff under Collin Street (Wilko?) which set the height where it is, certainly at the cinema corner but also running a good way back...?
 

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Yes, but you could build up a large raised plaza/piazza at the eastern end of Collin Street to that first floor cinema level - five/six feet above its current height.

(It wouldn't be a narrow "raised walkway" bolted to the side of the Broadmarsh.)

Move the entrance round to Collin Street. (I'd much rather have a blank Middle Hill than blank Collin Street.)

Have a leisure entrance that mirrors the ground floor entrance. Big and impactful. Food units that look out onto the street. (Some might just be through windows). Boom!

 

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Ah I think I get it now, thank you for persevering.

Yes you're right, that would be much better.
To all the architects and engineers reading, I'm sure it's not as easy as that!

But there must have been a solution where Intu and the city (who are putting up a third of the shopping centre development cost, remember, as well as bringing together the finance for Collin Street) got together and said "Can we make this better now we guarantee Collin St will get done? How can we remodel Collin St to help?"
 

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To all the architects and engineers reading, I'm sure it's not as easy as that!

But there must have been a solution where Intu and the city (who are putting up a third of the shopping centre development cost, remember, as well as bringing together the finance for Collin Street) got together and said "Can we make this better now we guarantee Collin St will get done? How can we remodel Collin St to help?"
I'm pretty sure the situation is closer to -
Intu: "OK here's our scheme"
NCC: "It's a bit crap, can you make some improvements"
Intu: "OK how about this"
NCC: "that's worse, please try harder"
Intu: "no, and that's our only proposal, take it or leave it"
NCC: "uh OK, well, if that's as good as it's going to get then fine"
Intu: "OK. Also we don't have enough money so if you don't pay us we wont do it at all"
 

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If the council played their cards right, if (when) Intu go into administration isn't there a huge opportunity to pillage their stake in Broadmarsh for a fraction of the cost, Mike Ashley style? And then regain some dignity, and some control.

That's what I'd be eyeing up if I were them.
 

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Probably one of the worst things to happen to us now would be Intu going bust.

You would have at least three/four/more years of delay, so four/five/more years before any new scheme was up and running, if any new scheme was ever up and running.
 

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Probably one of the worst things to happen to us now would be Intu going bust.

You would have at least three/four/more years of delay, so four/five/more years before any new scheme was up and running, if any new scheme was ever up and running.
Agreed. Unless the City Council were willing to run this project totally in house (which I simply can't imagine, unfortunately), the likelihood of a developer coming forward to quickly start work on demolition and transformation is pretty much nil.

Blackpool Council have had the right idea buying their shopping centre in order to extend it, and Houndshill is already a relatively modern centre with a very respectable occupancy rate. The time for this was, arguably, 20 years ago now for Broadmarsh.

Hopefully the Intu development will provide a stronger base for such a manoeuvre in a decade or two's time.
 
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