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Also each team having their own arenas is generally a mistake. Unless you're in a market like LA or NYC or Chicago, there is no need for more than one large indoor venue in a market. There simply aren't enough concerts and other events to go around. Glendale is having to subsidize Gila River Arena and the Coyotes. The Suns just got a big handout for the Stick, Saint Paul had to extend bond payoffs because they aren't getting enough from the Wild, etc.
To be fair, St. Paul is not an ancillary municipality such as Sunrise or Glendale.
 

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It's worth noting that debt servicing also plays a huge role in profitability. Renovating two older arenas for separate ice hockey and basketball arenas without much debt load is not a terrible idea. But taking on a lot of debt to build two expensive new arenas is a terrible idea.

Portland still operates the Blazers' original arena for its Western Hockey League team. It isn't big enough or good enough for an NHL team, but it still makes sense for the city to keep two arenas as long as the costs of the second arena are cheap.
 

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It's worth noting that debt servicing also plays a huge role in profitability. Renovating two older arenas for separate ice hockey and basketball arenas without much debt load is not a terrible idea. But taking on a lot of debt to build two expensive new arenas is a terrible idea.

Portland still operates the Blazers' original arena for its Western Hockey League team. It isn't big enough or good enough for an NHL team, but it still makes sense for the city to keep two arenas as long as the costs of the second arena are cheap.
Yes, you've brought up an important point. Building new arenas is a very expensive and financially risky endeavor. Unless there are "structural deficiencies" with the building itself (e.g. poor location, old seating bowl layout, basketball first layout with a hockey tenant, etc), it's almost always a better choice to renovate.

We're too the point now where just about every indoor arena in the NBA and NHL (Minus maybe... Calgary? and occasionally Islanders?) has the modern mid level suite layout. Only a few situations with a poor non-downtown location (Seems to be all NHL teams out in the burbs: Florida, Phoenix, Ottawa), and only one case where an NHL team is playing in a basketball first arena (Again, occasionally the Islanders, but that's finally being rectified)

There's not a whole lot of seismic shifts in the actual layout of the buildings on the horizon, except maybe we'll start to see some of the huge mid 90's buildings start to downsize a bit? A lot of these buildings are hopefully going to stick around a lot longer than 20-30 years, and we see mostly renovations from here on out.
 

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To be fair, St. Paul is not an ancillary municipality such as Sunrise or Glendale.
Yes, true, but that just means they're better insulated from the financial fallout. Not that it's a wise decision to go it alone on an arena. There was a state senator or some such politician a while back who was advocating for moving the Timber Wolves to the Xcel Energy Center, and redeveloping the Target Center land for some other use (condos, offices, etc). It came up about the time renovations were being discussed for Target Center.

The Coyotes in the case of Phoenix got plunked into a weird situation. When they moved here America West Arena was only 4 years old, and was built at a time when the idea of an NHL team in Phoenix was crazy (and thus was built basketball first). Had they built the arena to have a properly positioned ice rink, we're maybe having a slightly different arena conversation in the Phoenix market. Maybe Glendale isn't drowning from keeping their white elephant afloat.
 

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It's okay. Inflation is such a cruel beast.

I will say that the arena NEEDS a new scoreboard. Heck, the Coyotes replaced a similar-style scoreboard that the Suns are currently using a few seasons ago.
 

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It's okay. Inflation is such a cruel beast.

I will say that the arena NEEDS a new scoreboard. Heck, the Coyotes replaced a similar-style scoreboard that the Suns are currently using a few seasons ago.
On the subject of saving money, this is a strangely connected story. The 'new' large scoreboard in Gila River Arena was actually recycled from The Palace at Auburn Hills which had just undergone an extensive renovation, but was then closed so the Pistons and Red Wings (who were also closing Joe Louis) could move into LCA as the single large indoor venue in Detroit.
 

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^^ Yup, the Panthers' biggest mistake was abandoning Miami Arena and heading north to the deepest stretches of the suburbs instead of working with the Heat and AA Arena. At the time it may have made sense (teams in the mid 90s in general were heading out of city centers) but time has shown that for arenas (and baseball stadiums) downtown is where its at. And the Coyotes are an example of that as well!
I thought the mid-to-late-90s marked a time when teams (expect NFL franchises) were attempting to move closer to downtown cores? The Washington Capitols and the Washington Wizards, for example, moved out of Landover and into central DC.

Also, the Coyotes, the Panthers, and the Sens aren't the only teams stuck outside the downtown areas. The Carolina Hurricanes play at an arena that's across the street from an isolated college football stadium. The Flyers and Sixers play in South Philly. And the Blackhawks and Bulls play at the United Center, which is several miles west of The Loop. And the Spurs' arena is located next to the Freeman Coliseum, several miles east of Downtown San Antonio.

As for baseball, the Texas Rangers have no problem playing in Arlington instead of Dallas or Fort Worth. And the Royals' Kauffman Stadium is located next to Arrowhead Stadium, several miles east of Downtown Kansas City.

(I had some to study a little geography.:nuts:)
 

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Am I the only one who loves the renovations? I think the bar behind one of the baskets looks good and the scoreboard is huge
 

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Hi all,

Here's a video new Phoenix Suns Practice Facility. It's on 44th St & Camelbacks Rd.


Enjoy!
Looks cool - to me, that is such a random place to put it. And as someone who lives downtown, I wish it woulda been downtown, but at least it’s in PHX proper..
 
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