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Discussion Starter #1
Possibly not a building that receives much in the way of being noticed, as it is tucked away at the Eastern End of Market Street but I'm trying to find out if this was the building that used to house REED MILLICAN & CO LTD (Glass Makers) and STRAKERFORD (Strakers Car Showroom) in the late 1970's?

I was quite surprised to learn that PLUMMER HOUSE is Listed Grade II and was originally built as a Banquet and Assembly Rooms. Built i 1910 to a design by Newcombe and Newcombe for Tilley and Co. and later converted into offices.

One of the interesting parts of the building is that a sprung dance floor still exists on the first floor.

P.s This is the building that has Chapmans Furniture Shop - Siesta House in it.
 

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Possibly not a building that receives much in the way of being noticed, as it is tucked away at the Eastern End of Market Street but I'm trying to find out if this was the building that used to house REED MILLICAN & CO LTD (Glass Makers) and STRAKERFORD (Strakers Car Showroom) in the late 1970's?

I was quite surprised to learn that PLUMMER HOUSE is Listed Grade II and was originally built as a Banquet and Assembly Rooms. Built i 1910 to a design by Newcombe and Newcombe for Tilley and Co. and later converted into offices.

One of the interesting parts of the building is that a sprung dance floor still exists on the first floor.

P.s This is the building that has Chapmans Furniture Shop - Siesta House in it.

Before they moved to the corner of John Dobson Street/Northumberland Road (which is the building I am familiar with them being in) Reed Millican were, as you say, on Market Street.

This is confirmed in the 1959 Kelly's, but the address in their advert just says "Market Street", it doesn't give the name of the building they were in.

These photos are from 1908 and 1909 and show the Reed Millican building (though not fully) in the Market Street / Back Trafalgar Street, area . . .


Back Trafalgar Street (which crosses Market Street) in 1908 . .



This photo is described as "The Market Street extension, 1909". The stonework underneath the windows shows it is the same building as the "Back Trafalgar Street" building in the previous photo . . .

Photos courtesy of "The Newcastle City Council / City Libraries PHOTOSTREAM" - http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=Reed Millican&[email protected]


The bottom photo 'description' also states . . ."the photograph shows Tilley's crane in the foreground to the right".

So, bearing in mind the 1909 date of the photo and the 1910 completion date of Plummer House (for Tilley & Co) it looks like the photo shows Plummer House actually being built, and that Reed Millican was not in that building but in the building immediately to the East, on the corner with Back Trafalgar Street.

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Discussion Starter #3
Before they moved to the corner of John Dobson Street/Northumberland Road (which is the building I am familiar with them being in) Reed Millican were, as you say, on Market Street.

This is confirmed in the 1959 Kelly's, but the address in their advert just says "Market Street", it doesn't give the name of the building they were in.

These photos are from 1908 and 1909 and show the Reed Millican building (though not fully) in the Market Street / Back Trafalgar Street, area . .

The bottom photo 'description' also states . . ."the photograph shows Tilley's crane in the foreground to the right".

So, bearing in mind the 1909 date of the photo and the 1910 completion date of Plummer House (for Tilley & Co) it looks like the photo shows Plummer House actually being built, and that Reed Millican was not in that building but in the building immediately to the East, on the corner with Back Trafalgar Street.

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Thanks for the info and photographs NH - when the health improves must get down to that area of the City and take a look for myself :)
 

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Chapmans, Siesta Furnishing.

In continuation of the above discussion, the current occupants of Plummer House have always interested me - not least because through all the years that have seen big furniture retailing largely move "out of town" (where are 'Callers', 'Robsons', Waring & Gillow', 'Cantors', 'Broadloom Millls', etc, etc and their current-day equivalents, these days?) they have continued trading in City Centre shop premises.

Even further, their shops (unlike those that have disappeared) have never really been in exactly prime retail locations.

This is where I principally remember them being, on the corner of Jesmond Road and Great North Road, overlooking the Barrass Bridge/Haymarket area . . .



The shop, at the above address, in 1970 . . .


This photo was taken from where that shop was, only two years later in 1972 as CME construction started . . . revealing why they had to leave!!!



The same year, 1972, showing them newly esconsed in Plummer House on Market Street. You can see 'Brown Brothers' behind them (who my wife worked for, for a while) on Carliol Square . . .




PHOTOS, courtesy of the "Newcastle City Council / City Libraries PHOTOSTREAM" - http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=Chapmans&[email protected]

The final photo above is by Steve Ellwood - http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=78271778&postcount=1162

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Discussion Starter #5
Possibly not a building that receives much in the way of being noticed, as it is tucked away at the Eastern End of Market Street but I'm trying to find out if this was the building that used to house REED MILLICAN & CO LTD (Glass Makers) and STRAKERFORD (Strakers Car Showroom) in the late 1970's?

I was quite surprised to learn that PLUMMER HOUSE is Listed Grade II and was originally built as a Banquet and Assembly Rooms. Built in 1910 to a design by Newcombe and Newcombe for Tilley and Co. and later converted into offices.

One of the interesting parts of the building is that a sprung dance floor still exists on the first floor.

P.s This is the building that has Chapmans Furniture Shop - Siesta House in it.
Well I had a walk along Market Street (East) on Sunday and took some shots of PLUMMER HOUSE.

Here is the Listing Text, courtesy of http://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk

Description: Plummer House

Grade: II
Date Listed: 30 March 1987
English Heritage Building ID: 304702

OS Grid Reference: NZ2515864423
OS Grid Coordinates: 425158, 564423
Latitude/Longitude: 54.9738, -1.6085

Location: Market Street, Newcastle Upon Tyne NE1 6NE

Locality: Newcastle Upon Tyne
Local Authority: Newcastle upon Tyne
County: Tyne And Wear
Country: England
Postcode: NE1 6NE

NZ 2564 SW NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE MARKET STREET EAST
(south side)
21/379 Plummer House
G.V. II

Banquet and assembly rooms, later offices. 1910 by Newcombe and Newcombe for Tilley and Co. Sandstone ashlar; roof not visible. 4 storeys, 11 bays. Classical style. Alternate pediments to central 3 first floor windows, and
pediments to each 2 end bays; bracketed architraves to these and to sashes above, Intermediate recessed pairs of bays contain sashes in plain reveals. Prominent cornice to second-floor entablature; smaller sashes in plain reveals above. All windows with glazing bars. High roof balustrade with urns above corners of recessed sections and at end.

Listing NGR: NZ2515864423



 

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Plummer House - Planning Application submitted

There is a new application for even more student accommodation at Plummer House, Market Street East.
http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=MIRT6IBSAP000
There is an 'interesting' document which examines all the listed buildings in the area.
http://www.newcastle.gov.uk/wwwfileroot/legacy/regen/plantrans/GiffordFinalRepStage1.pdf
Maybe there's something in the offing?

Certainly is something on the way, the full text of what noted above-

This from NCC Planning Portal 20/03/13:-

2013/0348/01/DET

Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 7 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments (cluster and studio creating 253 bed spaces) with two retail (Class A1) at ground floor and basement, installation of new shop fronts, provision of landscaped courtyard and associated plant, cycle storage and refuse storage

Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne


http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=MIRT6IBSAP000

AND

2013/0349/01/LBC

Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 7 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard

Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne

http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=MIXGA2BS05100

Both "Pending Consideration"

KEN
 

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*Wipes sweat from brow* - Phew! It would be a disgrace if the listed part was demolished. I bet the proprietors of the Ware Rooms are rubbing their hands together with glee at the prospect of around 190 students on their doorstep.

I've said it many times on here though the market for student accommodation must now be at saturation point, if not already beyond it. When the HE market collapses it is going to be a terrible blight on Newcastle if many more of these buildings are approved.
 

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Plummer House

Picked out a couple of things...

Applicant is some lady from the Midlands but also states MARS Pension Fund.
253 bed spaces.
No car parking.
The scale of the buildings seems to me to overpower the Plummer Tower and PH.
I hope that PH retail is not turned into a supermarket. :eek:hno:

There are also plans for 600-800 student flats in the East Pilgrim Street area masterplan.

As has been said the Ware Rooms will be clapping their hands. :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Picked out a couple of things...

Applicant is some lady from the Midlands but also states MARS Pension Fund.
253 bed spaces.
No car parking.
The scale of the buildings seems to me to overpower the Plummer Tower and PH.
I hope that PH retail is not turned into a supermarket. :eek:hno:

There are also plans for 600-800 student flats in the East Pilgrim Street area masterplan.

As has been said the Ware Rooms will be clapping their hands. :cheers:
This is a typical example of the City Officers potentially being caught between a rock and a hard place when it comes to Grade Listed Buildings. The building is in need of substantial remedial work.

Amongst the various reports on EPS prepared over the years this is a cut and paste from the Gifford Report of September 2007 - EAST PILGRIM STREET, NEWCASTLE-UPON-TYNE CONDITION APPRAISAL AND CONSERVATION STATEMENT FOR EAST PILGRIM STREET,
NEWCASTLE-UPON-TYNE

Condition Appraisal

External
The roof is failing, flashing is missing in many places, seals for leading on skylights are missing in many places, wooden skylight frames rotting, often with window panes are cracked or broken. The felting is failing due to heat bubbling and general weathering. The brickwork is in need of re-pointing due to mortar degradation. The balustrade has been poorly repaired recently, with poor repointing and the application of unsuitable flashing materials, upon the removal of degraded or salvaged leadwork. Perspex skylights have been added to the roof, pebbledash render has been added to the rear section and unsympathetic porches and awnings applied to the shop front and east side entrance. Large shop windows are inserted at ground floor level, with pressed conglomerate cladding to the front pilasters, detracting from classical detailing. Light fittings have been inappropriately bolted to the string course above ground floor.


Internal
Rainwater is able to seep into building, collecting inside, resulting in rainwater damage to interior, including the degradation of concrete floor slabs and corrosion of steel beams and joists. Minor cracking to plasterwork is evident. Water, in the form of damp, has penetrated into basement area, particularly on east elevation, possibly due to slope of ground level. Internally in the shop area mezzanine floors have been inserted, while the main front staircase and other fittings detract from original scheme of interior.

Occupancy/Ownership The premises are only partly occupied and the vacant area of building is falling into disrepair. There is a known owner, from whom the occupants of the northern section (former tea rooms) are leasing.
 

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If I can nudge you guys in the direction of the design and access statement on the planning portal for good 3d impressions.
The overall choice of brick seems to be an attempt at creating a robust looking building, however I fear it looks in the doc quite gloomy and overbearing next to plummer tower. The massing should respond to the topography more, the south elevation looks a storey too high. Maybe the top storey should have been set back?
The way it reuses PH is quite innovative though. And great to see some investment in EPS!
I also like the way FYEO is subtly named 'gentlemens establishment' in the D&A s. Classy!
 

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Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 7 storey replacement extension to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments - Planning Application withdrawn

This from NCC Planning Portal 20/03/13:-

2013/0348/01/DET

Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 7 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments (cluster and studio creating 253 bed spaces) with two retail (Class A1) at ground floor and basement, installation of new shop fronts, provision of landscaped courtyard and associated plant, cycle storage and refuse storage

Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne


http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=MIRT6IBSAP000


KEN
For Information - on Newcasle Planning Portal 21/05/13 as WITHDRAWN

KEN
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Plummer House

Certainly is something on the way, the full text of what noted above-

This from NCC Planning Portal 20/03/13:-

2013/0348/01/DET

Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 7 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments (cluster and studio creating 253 bed spaces) with two retail (Class A1) at ground floor and basement, installation of new shop fronts, provision of landscaped courtyard and associated plant, cycle storage and refuse storage

Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne


http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=MIRT6IBSAP000

AND

2013/0349/01/LBC

Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 7 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard

Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne

http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=MIXGA2BS05100

Both "Pending Consideration"

KEN
Both Planning Applications have been withdrawn

Letter from NCC to the applicant 21st May 2013.

PROPOSAL: Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 8 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 192 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard

LOCATION: Plummer House, 11 Market Street East, Newcastle upon Tyne,

RECEIVED: 28 February 2013

Dear Sir/Madam

Further to recent discussion/correspondence in relation to the above, I confirm that the submission has been treated as withdrawn and that no further action will be taken upon it.

If at any future date you wish to proceed with the proposals, it will be necessary to prepare and submit an entirely new application.

Any fee you may have submitted with the application cannot under the Fees Regulations be refunded.

Quite a few objections which may have put the developer off?
 

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Plummer House was hardly a beacon for EPS redevelopment, but its a shame to see it withdrawn. Piecemeal development rather than obnoxious masterplanning over the historic street lines should be favourable- to develop around the listed buildings, not to flatten or demolish everything except the facade.

P
 

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2013/1281/01/LBC | Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 8 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 193 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard | Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne

Reference 2013/1281/01/LBC
Alternative Reference PP-02836343
Application Received Thu 22 Aug 2013
Address Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne
Proposal Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 8 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 193 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard
Status Pending Consideration
Appeal Status Not Available
Appeal Decision Not Available


http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=MSASO9BS09700


Application submitted for Plummer House to be Student Accommodation. Have a look at the Design and Access statement. Big grey, monolithic... :bash:
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Plummer House

2013/1281/01/LBC | Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 8 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 193 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard | Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne

Reference 2013/1281/01/LBC
Alternative Reference PP-02836343
Application Received Thu 22 Aug 2013
Address Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne
Proposal Listed Building Application: Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 8 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation comprising 193 apartments, installation of new shop fronts and provision of landscaped courtyard
Status Pending Consideration
Appeal Status Not Available
Appeal Decision Not Available


http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=MSASO9BS09700


Application submitted for Plummer House to be Student Accommodation. Have a look at the Design and Access statement. Big grey, monolithic... :bash:
So the developers are trying again - this is the second attempt as the last Planning Application fell through.

Plummer House has been previously discussed on the forum @

 

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Plummer House Student Accommodation - Planning application Granted

So the developers are trying again - this is the second attempt as the last Planning Application fell through.

Plummer House has been previously discussed on the forum @
This scan copy of article from The Chronicle of 31/10/13 stating that Planning "Granted" for Plummer House scheme - hosted on Photobucket



2013/1280/01/DET

Partial demolition of Plummer House and erection of 8 storey replacement extension with basement and internal and external alterations to provide student accommodation (Class C3 and C4) comprising 193 apartments (cluster and studio creating 248 bed spaces) with two retail (Class A1) at ground floor and basement, installation of new shop fronts, provision of landscaped courtyard and associated plant, cycle storage and refuse storage

Plummer House 11 Market Street East Newcastle upon Tyne

http://publicaccess.newcastle.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?activeTab=summary&keyVal=MS8LRJBS01R00


At time of posting NCC planning portal showing it as "Pending Consideration"

KEN
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Carliol Street - Plummer House

"The site remained undeveloped until the early 1800s. Thomas Oliver's map of 1830 shows buildings on the site. A plan of 1909 shows these properties (three storey town houses) proposed for demolition. They were the homes of architects, flour dealers and musical instrument sellers. The 1907 OS map shows the town houses set around a courtyard (Clarence Place) in the northern part of the site with a warehouse and commercial premises in the southern part. All of these buildings were demolished to make way for Plummer House in 1910. "

This is from one of the comments from the planning application that caught my eye.
" A plan of 1909 shows these properties (three storey town houses) proposed for demolition. They were the homes of architects, flour dealers and musical instrument sellers."

Can anyone shed any light on this? Any photos spring to mind Steve?
Looking at the documents with the Planning Application it appears that the relevant street on which Plummer House was built in the early 1900's was Carliol Street. I cannot locate any images of the buildings demolished to make way for Plummer House but did come across these from the 1930's and one from the 1970's on the Newcastle City Libraries Archive Collection. These may be to the north of Plummer House, or on the other side of the road but may be representative of other houses in Carliol Street?

035367:Carliol Street Newcastle upon Tyne Dept of Environmental Health c.1935
Type : Photograph Medium : Print-black-and-white Description : A view of Carliol Street Newcastle upon Tyne taken c.1935. The view shows the frontage of nos 28 - 32 Carliol Street. A woman is standing in front of one of the houses and another is standing in the doorway. The houses are occupied but form part of the Carliol Street Clearance Area.



035364:Carliol Street Newcastle upon Tyne Dept of Environmental Health c.1935
Type : Photograph Medium : Print-black-and-white Description : A view of Carliol Street Newcastle upon Tyne c.1935. The view shows the front of no. 31 Carliol Street which is adjoined by houses on both sides. One of the first floor windows of the house is open and a boy is leaning out of it. Several of the panes of glass are broken. A boy is standing in the doorway of no. 31 Carliol Street and a woman is standing outside. The house to the left is empty and is 'For Sale'. The house to the right is occupied and has curtains at the windows. The houses form part of the Carliol Street Clearance Area.



As this photograph was taken in the 1970's I have assumed that the one's above must have been on the western side of Carliol Street - if they were demolished in the 1930's that would make sense.

022231:Carliol Street Newcastle upon Tyne Signey J. 1972

Type : Photograph Medium : Print-black-and-white Description : A view of Carliol Street and Market Street from the roof of the City Library Newcastle upon Tyne taken in 1972. Carliol Street is in the foreground with a row of terraced houses to the left and commercial buildings to the right. Chapman's furniture shop on Market Street can be seen beyond the row of terraced houses. The premises of 'Thomson and Brown Brothers' on Worswick Street can be seen in the distance



Small reference to Carliol Street by Eneas Mackenzie in his book Historical Account of Newcastle-upon-Tyne: Including the Borough of Gateshead :

'In 1823, the south end of this field was purchased of the proprietor, James Graham Clarke, Esq. for building upon it the New Prisons and House of Correction. A street, nearly 50 feet wide, is now nearly completed, called Carliol Street, which runs from the Prisons to New Bridge Street; and another narrower street runs in a similar direction, called Erick Street, from a small runner of water, called Erick Burn, which bounded the west margin of the Croft.'
 

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Discussion Starter #20
From today's Journal Live, copyright NCJMedia Ltd @ http://www.thejournal.co.uk/business/commercial-property/newcastles-plummer-house-set-used-7051495

Plummer House set to be used for student accommodation
Apr 30, 2014 08:56 By Karen Overbury



Grade II Listed Plummer House, in Newcastle, most recently occupied by Chapman’s Furniture, has been sold by BNP Paribas Real Estate on the instructions of LaSalle Investment Management.

Plummer House, on Market Street, Newcastle, has been sold to Fusion Residential, a joint venture between Henry Homes Limited and Village Homes (Southern) LLP. The building will be redeveloped to provide a 248-room student accommodation scheme.

In the early years of the last century, the 1910 building was famously known for housing Tilley’s, which held tea dances in the ballroom. The features of the Listed building will be retained, along with the dance floor and some of the upper floor areas. The redevelopment will feature mezzanine bed decks to retain and utilise the high ceiling heights of these historic rooms.

The rear extension to the building, added in 1936, will be demolished with the construction of a seven-storey replacement. The scheme will also include new ground floor shops fronting Market Street and landscaped courtyards, which will improve the setting of the adjacent listed Plummer Tower.

Aidan Baker, director, Newcastle office agency at BNP Paribas Real Estate, commented: “The office accommodation at Plummer House has been vacant for some time and the decision to convert Plummer House into student accommodation and bring the building back into use is extremely positive for the city centre. Located at the junction of Market Street, John Dobson Street and Carliol Street means the building is only a short walk from the main retailing areas of Eldon Square and Northumberland Street, as well as being very close to Northumbria University’s campus.”
 
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