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Discussion Starter #1
I am posting this thread so that South Africans can post pictures with brief description of the major property developments in Port Elizabeth including residential, hospitality/tourism, office and mix-use. Port Elizabeth is a booming city because of the motor city's auto sector which is producing at record levels not seen in SA before and has the reputation of being the cleanest and one of the safest cities in SA. It even puts Cape Town to shame in this area. Please do post the major property developments in this city as I know there must be alot right now.
 

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Hey PE! Good luck with this thread. Even I, as a capetonian, dont know what PE looks like! Pathetic I know. But please do show us your city!!
East London as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
New Developments in PE

New developments in PE include the following:

1. Coega Harbour Development - Port of Nququra
2. Nelson Mandela Freedom Monument
3. Madiba Bay Tourism Development including Game Park
4. New Convention Centre & Hotel

Please find out the following developments and post any articles and pictures. Thank you.
 

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capetown said:
New developments in PE include the following:

1. Coega Harbour Development - Port of Nququra
2. Nelson Mandela Freedom Monument
3. Madiba Bay Tourism Development including Game Park
4. New Convention Centre & Hotel

Please find out the following developments and post any articles and pictures. Thank you.
dont forget the new stadium they will be building...
 

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is there much in the way of residential dev other than townhouses and golf estates? making use of their beaches!

A conference centre maybe a way of getting some people in, but i fear that it wont be large enought to compete with the icc in durban, the CT convention centre and the sandton convention centre. Therefore it may not have a the space to attract large conferences and PE definitely could not support it on their own.

Coega is a basically a gov finded initiative that doesnt really nake too much commercial sense. The harbour is too far away from Gauteng to compete with Durban Richards Bay and Maputo, and the rail lines will need massive investment anyway! It is good in theory, but i fell that in practice it may not succeed. The lack of commitment by foreign investors in the related industries near the port is a sign that they might not have faith in its long term position. But then again PE has to try something to turn itself around! otherwise it will completely fall off the map!

I do think they need to think out the box tho. try new things and not merely copy what durbs, ct and jozi offer. same goes for pretoria
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Dysan what do you think about East London/Buffalo City compared to PE?

Do you know of new hotel developments in PE, or East London?
 

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Well, these cities do need injections like Coega to stimulate this impoverished region. These cities surely have the population hinterland to sustain it in the future. With increased growth and FDI, PE & EL might very well compete with the current big 3 cities in 15-20 years time. Things are starting to happen for Coega & PE's motor industry is ever expanding.
 

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dont think any new hotels and stuff are going up there.

u never hear about pe or el in the paper, thats why i say that it feels like they dont exist!!!

i think that 15-20yrs is a bit soon...i'd go for a far longer term view. they do have a growing motor industry, which is a plus, but what is the attraction for people to invest there? yes they have this port, but i seriously doubt its usefullness. pe and el have their own ports, why would massive container ships want to dock in the middle of nowhere (in south african terms) and then have to freight their cargo further distances to gauteng, which lets face it, is where the majority of cargo that arrives in SA ports goes. The 2 kzn ports and Maputo make far more sense.

I just see the EC being propped up by gov initiatives, not always by commercial sense
 

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I read somewhere that there are plans by the city to tear down the motorway which seperates the city from the sea, and implement conditions there which would give rise to development. I agree with 'erb that in 15-20 years, PE will be different. Not sure about EL, but PE has a chance, especially given the monstrous statue they're going to build. But we shalt see I guess...
 
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That atrocious motorway.............maybe we'll see more up on Govan Mbeki...has fantastic potential. :)...Could become...the Commisioner Street of East Cape. I'd especially like to see offices go up there........save the resi towers for Humewood. Would be cool if Toyota, Chevrolet etc. had their offices in PE.


Of course...what happens if they do tear down the freeway?...Reroute the whole motorway?...Its kinda already established...I'd hate to see the traffic while construction is going on.
 

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Well in the article I remember reading that this motorway is pretty pointless considering that even at rush hour, it's not full at all. I think they'll put a type of V&A Waterfront there that will entice tourists into the city and connect them to the statue.

One thing I must say about PE is that they're terribly PC. Govan Mbeki Road. Nelson Mandela Metropolitan University. The Nelson Mandela Freedom Statue. Me thinks they spend more money on being PC than eliminating the fact that they're the most corrupt and one of the poorest provinces in SA...
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I think that the elevated freeway is a monstrosity. It should be tore down to make way for the waterfront. This freeway is appropriate in a developed country, but apartheid engineers in the 1960's didn't care about the development needs of SA which are not first world. The freeway should be diverted behind the CBD and should be at ground level as an elevated one would cost ten times more just as the current one did in the 1960's. Terrible planning that has literally killed the CBD in PE, which I think is the ugliest in the country. The area around Humewood on the other hand looks nice and that is where most of the property development has occured on down to Walmer Gardens. Sad that PE doesn't have much of a CBD as most business has fled to established suburbs south of the CBD.
 
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Yes well the "elevated" freewayas practically cut-off downtown PE from the rest of the city........it needs greater accsess. Not sure about the traffic.........I suppose people use the surface roads to avoid the views of the ugly CBD ;).......but really.....I would like to see PE get up, the area around Donkin Street is nice...and also near downtown.

But tearing it down?...that would be a massive undertaking!!! Not to mention the fact that they'd have to build SOMETHING new in its stead...so that the freeway flow isnt interupted!...perhaps PE just needs a beltway...so travelers can go AROUND the city, that way the CBD motorway can just be transformed into a wide, surface-level avenue.


And perhaps maybe Ibhayi is going somewhere......would be nice. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I agree. I think that the elevated expressway in Cape Town has got to go too!! It is obvious that the waterfront in CT can be extended to the Duncan Docks on the North Foreshore but this monstrosity is cutting it off from both the Foreshore and the V&A. Apartheid urban planners certainly didn't have good foresight. I think that both Cape Town and PE should have broad tree lined boulevards in place of these ugly freeways.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
Here two pics of Port Elizabeth from Emporis:





Here are four pics of notable highrise buildings in the PE CBD also from Emporis:

Postnet Building, 19 Floors, Built in 1991, Located in CBD. Pic taken July 2003.







The Beaches, 20 floors, Built in 1970's, Located in Humewood. This building looks like it is being remodeled inside the apartment units. Pic taken July 2003.




capetown
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Nelson Mandela Statue of Freedom

Here are the pics of the Nelson Mandela Statue of Freedom which will be taller than the Statue of Liberty in NYC. Pics are from the statue competition website. The statue is due to be completed by April 2009.










Winner announced by Judge Albie Sachs

18 July 2005

We have now reached the final stage of what has been a most extraordinary and rewarding competition, democratic and transparent all the way through. The interchanges were lively and frank - everybody spoke openly as equals, the two architects and the nine other members of the panel, mostly community representatives . Our only concern was to select the entry which best met the criteria of the competition brief.

CRITERIA

These were stated as follows:

- the Statue must reflect / embody / capture Umoya we Nkululeko ( the Spirit of Freedom )

- it must celebrate and symbolize the stature, life and work of Nelson Mandela and his comrades, and in particular their unwavering commitment to the future of SA

- provide an uncluttered space across which to journey towards the statue from all directions including symbolic references in that journey to “ The long walk to Freedom”

- be a place of reflection on the opportunities and responsibilities that follow from the achievement of freedom and the price that so many paid

- be a place and an image/symbol to revisit in person and in memory for inspiration and renewal – a spiritual place not just a place to be photographed

- act as an icon of sustainable regeneration for the Nelson Mandela Metro and the Eastern Cape and contribute directly to the redevelopment of the Port and CBD at Port Elizabeth

- act as a visitor attraction that would be a key part of any visit to South Africa from other countries of the world and a key reason for all South Africans to visit the Metro as least once in their lives.

PROCESS

The open and democratic way in which we worked had three consequences.

In the first place, we found a way in which technical expertise could be relied upon to ensure that projects were feasible, that they could be managed and carried out. But we were at pains not to allow technical considerations to dominate the ultimate choice. The final was to be based on the sense of the members of the panel as to the entry which best captured and responded to the criteria mentioned in the brief . The technical advisory panel indeed played an exceptionally important role in analyzing the different entries in terms of their feasibility, so that our choices could be meaningful. Towards the end they worked late into the night and we highly appreciate the enormous energy they invested and the sense of security that they gave us.

Thank you to members of the technical team - if you are awaiting with a certain measure of agonized expectation as to the outcome, the tension will not be prolonged. But we kept the information from you, in keeping with the general approach relating to the autonomy of the panel.
The decision is the decision of the panel with the back-up of the technical team - it is not the decision of the technical team.

The second feature of the process was that we had very open, free discussions and we documented the proceedings all the way through. We feel that this is a public project - the public has great interest in the outcome and the public has a right to know as much as is reasonable about the process. Here I would like to pay a tribute to Ashwin Daya who has been a faithful scribe sitting in on what were at times extensive debates, trying to capture as well as he could the character of the discussion, and the decisions that were taken. The result has been that we have documented in narrative form the proceedings from the beginning to the end. So thank you very much Ashwin - because you were there you do know the outcome and that is why you are sitting smiling right now and possibly feeling a bit smug in relation to others in the audience.

PUBLIC INVOLVEMENT

The third feature is that we have tried to involve the public as much as possible. This has meant that we have made the exhibition entries accessible to the public. The process was first to look at the 107 entries we received from all over the country. We made what we called a long short list of about 25 and we narrowed that down to 10 which became the short list. The ten were invited to Port Elizabeth to present their entries to the judging panel – one withdrew and that left nine. We then shortened the nine to three. One of the three finalists withdrew and so we were left with two. Meanwhile we invited the press to reproduce images of the three finalist entries, and there was quite an extensive public response. This was not simply a gathering behind closed doors taking a decision in a way that nobody understood. Public participation was encouraged and reached its climax at the final round, which was held in public at the Feather Market Centre. The panel listened to each of the finalists presenting for 45minutes, and then questions were posed to the finalists for over an hour each. The public present were able to follow the proceedings and get a sense of the nature of the dialogue, of what matters we considered to be of importance in an issue like this.

Again I mention that in each case every single member of the panel had questions to help make up his or her own mind as to the respective merits of the two entries. We also captured the proceedings of the last phase on video, which means that we will have extensive documentation of the process from start to finish. Our hope is that what I call the Mandela Bay competition process ( PE Process ) will be studied as adding to the models of how future competitions can be conducted in our evolving democracy. This efficiently organized competition, with a clear and well prepared brief, reflects and strengthens the contemporary spirit of discovery subject to accountability and transparency. Hopefully these materials will be converted into appropriate forms for widespread use and reference by interested parties.

Well done Nelson Mandela Metro and well done Mayor Faku!

THE FINALISTS

We will now turn to our reflections on the two finalists. Each could have been a winner. Each responded forcefully to the competition brief. Having such powerful entries made our task both easier and more difficult. Difficult because the choice was hard, easier because the panel was comparing one strong entry with another strong entry.

In the course of our discussions we labeled the entries Butterfly and Tower.

Butterfly
Butterfly was the name given by the consortium itself to its entry. It had immediately attractive qualities. The long journey of 27 years in prison was represented by 27 steps arriving at the statue of freedom of Mandela with arms triumphantly outstretched. This could be understood by any visitor. There were extensive areas for public participation and activities that went beyond simply going to look at the statue and walk up the stairs. There was a sense of openness, cheerfulness and welcome in the whole area. The symbolism of the butterfly was a bit controversial in as much as the butterfly is fragile and the quest for freedom had to be robust. A butterfly is seen as inconstant. Yet a butterfly is beautiful, active and imaginative. More important than the ambiguity of the symbol was a concern that while undoubtedly attractive as an ensemble, the entry lacked a clear, central and logical organizing principle. The structural and symbolical elements were too diverse to make a strong impact. Yet freedom has to be nurtured, it has to be looked after, freedom comes in varied forms…………………….the debate continues.

The statue of Mandela at the top did not seem to emerge from the building on which it stood but appeared as if plonked on top. Another query related to the very literal quality of the representation of the life of one individual, the physical representation of Nelson Mandela himself. It was asked whether this would not become dated in a monument that is meant to be enduring, and whether or not this did not downplay the fact that Mandela always operated as part of a collective. This literal representation would isolate the individual from the movement and the people in which he grew to exercise leadership. What in a way was a strength of the entry, risked becoming a weakness - the strength being its immediate accessibility, the weakness being that it had too much of a focus on an individual at a particular moment in time, and potentially losing its appeal as a lasting memorial.

Tower
The Tower of freedom on the other hand functioned in a far more abstract and symbolical way. It represented the spirit of the time, without being immediately recognizable in relation to an individual or particular historical moment. The structure is striking. Its emphasis is not on the use of columns, arches or frames, but based on layering great hollow blocks one upon the other. This gives a rather intriguing reference to ancient forms of building found in pyramids mostly in what is today called third world countries. Yet it has a distinctively modern character because it literally has a twist and an interesting angular spiraling shape. The spiral itself is a strong symbol of ever moving upwards, from heavier darker regions at the base towards lighter regions at the top. There is a possibility of then descending back to the safety and comfort of the earth in the second part of the journey.

Again the strength of the design could end up providing its weakness. The extensive use of concrete, unless skillfully handled with fluent transitions from one space to the other and interesting variation and changes of mood, could become repetitive and could represent the spirit of enclosure and prison rather than the spirit of freedom. Concrete can be a very malleable material but it can also be very depressing, so a lot would depend on how it would be used. The main objection or critique of this particular monument was that it could be too hard; the message of freedom could be too indistinct and it could be too unfriendly. There was also concern that it could be a monument anywhere in the world, and was not immediately identifiable with the struggle for freedom in SA.

POINTS IN COMMON

The two entries are very different but have much in common. Each involves a long walk, the one up the spine of the building, the other an even longer walk through the tubes to get to the summit and the walk down again. Each would have a lift, which would facilitate access for less hardy people, although the question of access would have to receive special attention.

Each proposal is based on the assumption that people from all parts of the city as well as visitors from outside would be lured and entranced by the extraordinary setting between beach, sea and harbour. Each would invite active participation, and not simply passive contemplation. In both cases, the success of the project would depend upon converting the approaches to the site from a despoiled industrial landscape into an inviting, scenic area made historically interesting through skilful use of some of the existing industrial structures.

Given in broad terms the commonalities, strengths and possible weaknesses of each of the two entries I now turn to the decision that we took, and the reasons for ultimately reaching a consensus as to the winner.

THE FINAL DECISION

The factors that ultimately proved to be decisive were the strength and compactness of the design, coupled with both the evident cohesive energy of the design team and the possibilities of producing an icon that could be seen from land, sea and air and remembered as a distinctive feature of Mandela Bay/Port Elizabeth that could stand the test of time.

In our view the Tower envisaged by Equilibrium Studios has the potential to be a most remarkable monument, that will be admired and enjoyed for decades and centuries to come. It has a unique structure that would be simultaneously simple and striking when viewed from afar, and yet interesting and full of surprises when journeyed through within.

The possibilities are limitless for occupying the interior spaces with lively exhibits telling the story not only of Nelson Mandela but also of the people of Port Elizabeth, the Eastern Cape region ,the country as a whole, as well as stories about struggles in other parts of the world. The spaces invite the intervention of interior designers, artists, crafts people, sociologists, poets and freedom fighters to provide texture, colour and meaning. The views through the rectangular framed windows will change constantly from land to sea and land again, both as the visitor ascends and descends, and as the moving sea and changing sky express their variety.

A strong feature of the Tower is that it appears literally to grow out of its environment. It is both a distinctive feature in relation to the environment because it is so high, almost a 100m, giving wonderful possibilities to view from and be viewed. At the same time the materials from which it will be made will reflect the dolosse in the sea, a South African invention dealing with the tides , as well as the seawalls near by. It has a strong sense of natural connection with the marine environment and marks the point of intersection or confluence between the beach and sand dunes to the south, the sea to the east, the working harbour to the north and the city to the west.
It also has limitless possibilities for capturing and reflecting the sun during the day and being illuminated at night

The Equilibrium team manifested an inspirational sense of originality, spontaneity, thoughtfulness and energy. They are the kind of people that a competition is designed to discover, with intense creativity and the capacity to produce something memorable. Perhaps the most telling moment at the interview came when I asked one member of the team who happened to be older and the only one who both wore a tie and had said nothing, what he was doing there. He replied that he was a local engineer who had been working in the city for 40 years and had never from an engineering point of view seen a building as extraordinary as this one. He was convinced it would work and be astonishing.
After carefully weighing all the pros and cons of both the finalists, the panel unanimously agreed that it should be the winner.

On behalf of the panel, I congratulate Aloeides Clarki on being the runners up in this extraordinary competition, and pronounce that the winner is Equilibrium Studios.

Happy Birthday Madiba! The model will be on its way to you. We hope it will honour the noble struggle of the people of SA and the prominent role you played in it.

Albie Sachs
Chairperson - Judging Panel

Mamisa Chabula – judge
Glenton de Kock - judge
Sicelo Fayo - judge
Albrecht Herholdt – judge
Mandla Madwara - judge
Thembinkosi Matunda – judge
Kenny McDonald – judge
Irene Nomhle Moutlana – judge
Mphethi Morojele – judge
Nceba Moss – judge
Sipho Pityana – judge


cape town
 
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