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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)


Referendum Decision day 18th Sep 2014. Tony offensive to Scotland Nationalists

Scotland's first minister has said the Australian prime minister's comments on Scottish independence were "foolish, hypocritical and offensive".

Alex Salmond was speaking after Tony Abbott told the Times it was "hard to see how the world would be helped by an independent Scotland".

Mr Abbott said those who would like to see the UK break up were "not the friends of justice... [or] freedom".

The first minister said this was offensive to the people of Scotland.

Voters in Scotland will go to the polls on 18 September.

They will be asked the "Yes/No" question: "Should Scotland be an independent country?"

The Scottish government believes the 300-year-old Union is no longer fit for purpose, but the UK government opposes the move, saying Britain is one of the world's most successful unions.

'Most outspoken'
Mr Abbott told the Times: "What the Scots do is a matter for the Scots and not for a moment do I presume to tell Scottish voters which way they should vote.

times
"But as a friend of Britain, as an observer from afar, it's hard to see how the world would be helped by an independent Scotland.

"I think that the people who would like to see the break-up of the United Kingdom are not the friends of justice, the friends of freedom, and the countries that would cheer at the prospect... are not the countries whose company one would like to keep."

Mr Salmond told BBC Scotland: "Mr Abbott's comments are hypocritical because independence does not seem to have done Australia any harm.

"They are foolish, actually, because of the way he said it. To say the people of Scotland who supported independence weren't friends of freedom or justice, I mean, the independence process is about freedom and justice."

The first minister said Scotland's referendum on independence was a "model of democratic conduct" and Mr Abbott's comments were "offensive to the Scottish people".

Mr Salmond said the Australian prime minister was "notoriously gaffe-prone" and he had "put his foot right in it" with his comments.

He added: "If it does anything it will persuade people to vote Yes because the natural reaction to this sort of nonsense is 'Who is Mr Abbott to lecture Scots on freedom and justice?'"

US President Barack Obama and Chinese premier Li Keqiang have previously voiced support for the UK.

Mr Obama said last month that the US had a "deep interest in making sure that one of the closest allies we will ever have remains a strong, robust, united and effective partner", while Mr Li said he wanted to see a "united United Kingdom" on a visit to Downing Street.

BBC Scotland political correspondent Glenn Campbell said Mr Abbott's comments were the most outspoken of any international leader on the forthcoming referendum.

Mr Abbott also held talks with Foreign Secretary Philip Hammond on the subject of the Ukraine crisis and the downing of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 during his visit earlier this week.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-28814936
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Alex Salmond's bitter salvo at 'hypocrite' Australian prime minister over warning that Scottish nationalists are not 'friends of justice or freedom'



Tony Abbott said it was 'hard to see' how independence would help world
PM said he made comments as a 'friend of Britain' and 'observer from afar'
English-born monarchist, who leads centre-right party, studied at Oxford
But Alex Salmond slammed comments as 'hypocritical' and 'bewildering'
First minister said independence 'has not done Australia any harm'
The ballot will take place on September 18 - expected to have 80% turnout


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ence-arent-friends-freedom.html#ixzz3AZFK7vcv
 

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1. What business is it of the world's? Only major ramification seems to be the UK might need to look for somewhere else to park its SSBNs and nukes.

2. What business is it of this country or its PM to have an opinion one way or the other on something of zero relevance to our interests but which just makes us look petty to one of the 2 sides?
 

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Well, the answer to that question depends on a number of factors.

If you believe that an independent Scotland would benefit the people of Scotland and redistribute wealth away from London, improving the quality of life of the poor in Scotland. A wealthier Scotland would arguably improve the world.

If you also believe that an independent Scotland would ensure that a Tory government would never again rule a country that despises it, then that would benefit the world in the interests of democratic representation and fairness.

If you are against nuclear weapons proliferation, then an independent Scotland would push to get the UK's nuclear deterrent removed from its territory. By making nuclear weapons less convenient for the UK, this could arguably benefit the world.

I don't necessarily agree 100% with the above views, but approximately one third of Scots appear to agree (the 'yes' voters).
 

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How interesting. Tony Abbott and Kevin Rudd were born only a few weeks apart in 1957. Tony Abbott & Julia Gillard are both born in the UK.



Anyway back to it.....



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I don't really think the Scottish should go independent. They really will not benefit.

Yes, the same argument was used for the Irish but their situation was more about preserving their indigenous Gaelic culture and Catholic religion rather than economics. Scotland isn't advocating any such reason as it all seems to be about economic issues. No one is advocating bringing back Scots Gaelic as an official language like what happened in Ireland.

So since it is about money Scotland is better off in the UK.
 

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Simultaneously doing his UK Tory mates a favour and moving the news cycle on from Hockey's incompetent blundering with an issue that nobody in Australia gives a shit about. Smart politics.
 

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Simultaneously doing his UK Tory mates a favour and moving the news cycle on from Hockey's incompetent blundering with an issue that nobody in Australia gives a shit about. Smart politics.
It is an attempt to distract but it just seems to be another example in a long line of blunders.

It doesn't. Nor does it benefit Scotland. It's a bit like Western Australian secession.
I think the history behind the Scotland vote is a lot different even if there are similarities in the mining resources.
 

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Pom here, so go easy....

This is about what's best for Scotland, not what's best for the World. Why would Abbott frame his point of view in that way?! At least Obama was subtle in his support for UK unity and didn't tread on the toes of the Scottish electorate or come across as dismissive. I have to say, as much as I dislike the details of Salmond's "independence" proposals (the double quotes are deliberate), Abbott really comes across as an idiot in saying this in the way he has.

I don't know what his aim is. If it's to distract from issues in Australia maybe he's suceeded (you tell me!). But if it's to help maintain the unity of an ally, he's probably only managed to get the backs up of a number of Scottish voters who are still mulling over which way to vote. :applause:
 

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What a fuckwit - have an opinion but don't say insulting stupid shit like this

"Mr Abbott said those who would like to see the UK break up were "not the friends of justice... [or] freedom".
 
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