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Discussion Starter #1
Project details:

Owner/Developer : Crescent Heights
Architect : LMN
Uses:
Retail - 30,000 sf
Office - 160,000 sf
Residential - 1,020,000 sf
TOTAL - 1,210,000 sf

840 units with 400 parking spaces.

Demolition of all existing structures (from Cherry to Columbia along 4th)

They might be calling it "4th & Columbia"

Apparently the Airport Height District range for this spot is 988-1008 feet. Fingers crossed...
 

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Based off of the site size and building square footage, could an approximate height range (measured in floors) be established based on the FAR allowed in this part of downtown?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
That would be just a guess though, one possibility. No FAR constraints on residential (right?) and this is the 'unlimited' zone.
 

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According to Wikipedia for a full Seattle block it's 240' x 320' = 76,800 so /2 = 34,800. 1,200,000 / 34,800 = ~35 floors. Obviously the tower would be quite a bit higher than that since 1.2m sf is the habitable space. By comparison, Columbia Center is 1.538m and has 76 floors but obviously isn't the perfect rectangle of Seattle skyscrapers we've become used to.
 

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honk!!!
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According to the county's parcel viewer, the two lots are each 14,280 square feet, so this project's lot would be 28,560 square feet overall. Based off the building's square footage, that means a box encompassing the entire lot would be at least 42 stories.

According to this, the site falls under DOC1 (Downtown Office Core 1) zoning, which has the following rules:

Non-residential Uses: Unlimited
Residential Uses: Base height 450'
Height with bonus unlimited

Edit: From what I understand, the height limit is 450' for residential unless affordable housing is included or paid for, in which case there is no height limit. It also appears LCIII is correct in that the FAR restrictions don't apply to residential projects.

Relevant documents:

https://www.municode.com/library/wa/seattle/codes/municipal_code?nodeId=TIT23LAUSCO_SUBTITLE_IIILAUSRE_DIV2AUUSDEST_CH23.49DOZO_SUBCHAPTER_IGEPR_23.49.011FLARRA&showChanges=true

https://www.municode.com/library/wa/seattle/codes/municipal_code?nodeId=TIT23LAUSCO_SUBTITLE_IIILAUSRE_DIV2AUUSDEST_CH23.49DOZO_SUBCHAPTER_IIDOOFCO1DOOFCO2DOMICO_23.49.046DOOFCO1DODOOFCO2DODOMICODMCOUSCODE
 

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It would be amazing for something to go there in the next few years, but I'm not sure if it will fit in this business cycle...Call me a market pessimist with all the global cool-down we're facing. :coffee:
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I never understand that sort of comment. Is it supposed to be insightful? All sorts of things can happen to halt a project. This isn't news. We're all painfully aware of that reality.
 

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Want speculate about height Mhays? You probably understand all this more than any of us. If FAR doesn't count against the residential portion of this project what do you think the changes are for a new tallest at this location, given how many units it is?
 

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I can't imagine they'd want the residential units to stare into the ugly Pacific Building so if I had to guess I'd assume they'll put the tower containing the residential units on the quarter of the block adjacent to the Arctic Club. Its much shorter and would ensure water views from most floors for west facing units. At least thats what Im hoping for...
 

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I'm not Mhays, but this must be quite tall- 1201 Third Ave is 1.1 million sq ft, 770 feet tall, and takes up most of the block. So on a substantially smaller footprint, with 100,000 more sq ft, one would assume it needs to be much taller than 770', right?
 

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I'll take an amateur stab at it.

Let's start with the podium. That'll be Retail - 30,000 sf - that's clearly the 1st floor, as a half block is 34k (the rest will be elevators, etc.).

Put another floor (a guess) of residential and office amenities in a podium. We're up to 68ksf.

Office - 160,000 sf (though some eaten up in my amenities floor). I would think they go up a few more floors of podium. Maybe all the way to floor 7. I don't know what shapes the building beyond that - setbacks? FAR? Either way that seems to be what happens in Seattle. So for the office part of the podium we'll put in 136k. We're up to 238ksf and have made it up to floor 7.

Residential - 1,020,000 sf (minus what I used in amenities). This is the big question. One tower or two? And how big? I think we're seeing between 10k and 20k floorplans for residential. Going with 20k we make it up to 57 stories. I'm not sure we can fit two 10k towers on the site, but if so you'd end up with the same height.

Factors that would change this:
Do offices really want podium space? I assume so for efficiently large floor plates, but that's a guess. If not, the tower gets taller.
Is there a large premium for tall residential? If they go with a single tower with less than 20ksf they can easily max out their height. Of course height is expensive, so there's a balance there.
The open space issue. I know Seattle requires open space for offices, generally at the ground floor, and that makes for a terrible pedestrian experience. This may significantly shrink the office and amenity levels and make the tower taller.
 

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According to Wikipedia for a full Seattle block it's 240' x 320' = 76,800 so /2 = 34,800. 1,200,000 / 34,800 = ~35 floors. Obviously the tower would be quite a bit higher than that since 1.2m sf is the habitable space. By comparison, Columbia Center is 1.538m and has 76 floors but obviously isn't the perfect rectangle of Seattle skyscrapers we've become used to.
But the site is not half a block
 

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Is Crescent Heights a large enough firm to have two projects progressing concurrently in a market? I know Holland is, but the firm that did Cielo wanted that wrapped up before moving on the Icon tower (which I believe is going through the permitting stage now).

I certainly hope Crescent is, as this is a perfect site for development.
 
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