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I agree, they are a bad thing. Look what happened to Hamilton, Vancouver, Edmonton and Victoria after they hosted the games, what a sorry bunch of hellholes. :crazy:

and I am not an "art college" student and I hate all types of coffee.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
skyscraper_1 said:
I agree, they are a bad thing. Look what happened to Hamilton, Vancouver, Edmonton and Victoria after they hosted the games, what a sorry bunch of hellholes. :crazy:

and I am not an "art college" student and I hate all types of coffee.

well then move on skycraper because the games are not happening in halifax and if you are looking at history 76 years back in hamilton then that is pretty weak . Along with 12 years ago in victoria, 28 years ago in edmonton, and 52 years ago in vancouver !!!!!. Wow how to think your entitled to something that you cant even pay for. Got a little secret here for you . Read the daily news of today . The city needs a sewer system and that will be the out for the city the province and the feds.funny the article about the short fall was right above bruce devennes new op ed piece on the commonwealth games costs.
Peter Kelly will bite the bullet blaming the council for getting rational and pulling the games support. Even andrew younger a games supporter is wondering what is up with the No show for the committees briefing the other night.
Rodney MacDonald ,John Hamm and the rest of the nova scotia tories will say "well we tried but the council decided to withdrawn"
Then Stephen Harper thru his nova scotia monthpeice Peter Mackay will offer a solution to the budget shortfall for sewer system repair just like saint johns a month ago. Then we will also get the same package for highway to double lane the valley highway of death that the liberals would not do. The tories can knock off scott brison and roger thibault as they were at the paul martin table and thibault espeically could go next election seing how he barely became mp agianst greg kerr.

You see you have to be able to actually provide REAL services to the people who live here not Athletes who are here for 10 days 8 years from now and gone forever. Politicians also need to do things that matter to real people paying real taxes in the real world in order to Get Real votes in elections not people playing Sim City all day being urban planner in their wildest fantasies . That amounts to about 17 people on the bob and atlantic online live site .
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
top ten dumb reasons for building a stadium

10. SHAKESPEARE NEVER WON THE SUPER BOWL: Cleveland Browns owner Art Modell, who moved his team to Baltimore in exchange for a new stadium built entirely at public expense, told reporters that "The pride and presence of a professional football team is more important than 30 libraries."

9. THIS TIME, WE MEAN IT: San Francisco Giants owner Bob Lurie announced before a 1987 stadium referendum that it was the "last hope" of keeping the team from moving. He said the same thing before similar referenda in 1988 and 1992. He ultimately sold the team in 1993 to local owner Peter Magowan, who kept it in the city. HONORABLE MENTION: Houston Astros owner Drayton McLane, for threatening in 1996 to move his team to Virginia, even as that state was rejecting all attempts to build a baseball stadium.

8. IF YOU LOVED ME YOU'D BUY ME A STADIUM: When opponents to a new stadium for the Seattle Mariners tried to delay the project until it could be resubmitted for public vote, the team's ownership announced they were putting the team up for sale and withdrawing from the construction project. "Reluctantly, after more than three years of work toward fulfilling the dream of thousands of fans," the owners declared, "the Baseball Club of Seattle has concluded that there is insufficient political leadership in King County to complete the ballpark project in 1999." A week later, a deal was brokered to build the stadium, and extend an extra $94 million in subsidies from the city, county, and stadium agency.

7. THINK OF THE MARKETING POSSIBILITIES: In the final season of play at Comiskey Park in Chicago in 1991, the White Sox offered fans the opportunity to order bricks from the soon-to-be demolished stadium, take part in a $1,700 fantasy camp at the stadium for a "lifetime of memories," or enter the True Value Hardware and Dodge sweepstakes for a chance to win a new van and be the person to turn out the lights for the last time at the historic ballpark.

6. WASTE IS A TERRIBLE THING TO MIND: When the Miami Heat wanted a new arena, they hired political campaign manager Mike Murphy, who designed a series of TV commercials featuring the line, "Some politicians want to kill the new waterfront park, and keep the tourist money for their wasteful spending!" Thanks in part to the ads, Miami voted to build their second basketball arena in a decade -- because the old one had too few luxury suites.

5. IT'S GOD'S WILL: "The guy upstairs must've really wanted this to happen!" San Francisco 49ers president Carmen Policy exclaimed after voters approved a stadium-building referendum. It was the 49ers, though, and not divine intervention that spent $2 million -- $33 per yes vote -- assuring a victory.

4. IT'LL EVEN HAVE A CD PLAYER: Then-baseball commisioner Fay Vincent, giving his support for the destruction of historic Comiskey Park in Chicago, said that the oldest stadium in the country was like "an old car. You have fond memories but the new one is nicer."

3. THE SKY IS FALLING: Denver Broncos owner Pat Bowlen demanded a new publicly funded stadium for his football team in 1996 because, he said, their current home of Mile High Stadium was literally falling down. "This is a serious, serious question," said Bowlen. "Where do we play in 1998 or 1999 if that stadium is condemned?" They will play, it turns out, in Mile High -- which an engineering study found could "last indefinitely" if properly maintained. HONORABLE MENTION: San Francisco 49ers owner Eddie DeBartolo, Chicago White Sox owners Jerry Reinsdorf and Eddie Einhorn, and former Detroit Tigers owner Tom Monaghan, all of whom made similar claims about their structurally sound stadiums.

2. A MILLION HERE, A MILLION THERE...: In full-page newspaper ads in 1990, Cleveland's Central Market Gateway Project promised that a new sports complex would generate "$15 million a year for schools for our children." Instead, the Cleveland Teachers Union has calculated, tax breaks given to the project have drained $3.5 million a year from the Cleveland school system, which is now in receivership.

And the number one dumbest reason given for building a sports stadium with public money...

1. IT'S THE CURE FOR CANCER: In the weeks before a legislative vote on a new stadium, the Minnesota Twins ran a TV commercial featuring a ballplayer visiting a boy in the hospital. A voiceover announced, "If the Twins leave Minnesota, an 8-year-old from Willmar undergoing chemotherapy will never get a visit from Marty Cordova." It later turned out that the boy had already died by the time the commercial aired. Oops.
 

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This guy makes the same posts on half a dozen different forums, often just copying and pasting them. It's fine to point out flaws that you find in the whole process but posting pages and pages of largely irrelevant ramblings is a bit different.

If you are so certain that the games aren't going to happen then why are you bothering to go on your little crusade? Your time could be better spent learning how to use punctuation, develop coherent arguments, etc.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
ahhh my crusade is for the truth to be known not about a grammer lesson. You dont like the message I deleiver then continue to close your eyes turn away and join the party as they drive you in a school bus over a cliff. You can kiss your quality of life goodbye because of the tax bill to come. Today I found more information saying this is a very bad idea. The entire asian market with the exception of India TV right's for was worth a mere $ 400.000.00 US dollars for the 2006 games. In other words more was spent on the domestic bid for Halifax then Asian Tv Rights. Before the chorus begins to sing about India. They refused the $ 600.000 demanded by 2006 games officials because they only paid a little over $ 200.000 US dollars in 2002 for manchester.
The only market that was signed 14 months prior to the opening ceremonies for Melbourne was Australia itself for a 50 million Australia. Channel Nine owned by the richest man in australia was the sucker. with 20 million in production costs and no market interested in bargaining in good faith Mr. Packer was quoted as saying "we will loss 50 million on this deal".

With a rights fee of 40 milion american for games organizers to pay the federation the host country has to sucker an unknowning network into doing the work. On the losses that Kerry Packer's channel nine experienced dont expect a deal like that to be made with any canadian networks and the rumored paying of the CBC to broadcast the games will have the australians playing very hard ball if Halifax comes knocking and you will probably see not commonwealth games coverage in australia if it is held in Halifax.

Interesting that the Asians decreased their payout for CWG rights from $ 450.000 in manchester to $ 400.000 for melbourne.
By 2014 the games rights for that territory will be in the neighboorhood of $ 300.000 or less.

The problem for Halifax is that the only sponsor so far that gets value internationally in their list is Scotiabank. I am sure Scotiabank will be interested in paying 20 million like a who's who of australia business did. Scotiabank however only has a presence in the carribean and south america beyond our shores so 20 million would be charity. The sobeys,aliant and emera will probably not be as giving.

jim jones
 

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You live in Pictou don't you, why does this issue concern you so much? It will effect the city of Halifax much more than it will the province of Nova Scotia.

Besides if you haven't noticed this forum is about urban development and tall buildings. If you wan't to speculate about what may or may not be built as a part of the CommonWealth Games bid that's fine - otherwise keep your thoughts to a more relevant forum.
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
hey I started a trend so if you dont like just ignore it. and as far as me being from pictou lets put it this way . Pictou is a part of nova scotia which is being asked to pony up MORE then the HRM. Sure people in halifax pay sales tax too but why should pictou be asked for any involvement what so ever when it does not benefit us and will actually add to the provinces debt. I beleive the handout should stop for everything. sobeys, michelin, stora, the cbc,the commonwealth games and Costco in the chain lake industrial park which is an arm of the chinesse government. The city of halifax provided the land for 1 dollar with it serviced and cleared plus a 20 year tax holiday. Too bad the sobeys have to compete against the chinesse paying nothing to the HRM.
Half of downtown Halaifax is owned by sobeys yet they didnt have that deal for scotia square???
you see in pictou county we just happen to have a coal fired electric generating plant for emera. Not one dine is paid in commercial tax to the town of trenton. This plant was build to supply the increased demand in nova scotia and that has come from the HRM and other areas.
Tuff cove however has Emera and the prior company nova scotia power paying 5 million a year in taxes to Dartmouth and then the HRM. So who is on more of the government purse and who has the discomfort of generating power with dirty coal for the city.
The funds that are being hijacked for a commonwealth games provincially could be used to convert trenton to natural gas thus making living in this province a little fairer or atleast a little cleaner. Hey the 5 million a year you can keep just remember what this part of the province has to go thru to turn the lights on in metro.
 

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Jonestowncultinpicto said:
hey I started a trend so if you dont like just ignore it. and as far as me being from pictou lets put it this way . Pictou is a part of nova scotia which is being asked to pony up MORE then the HRM. Sure people in halifax pay sales tax too but why should pictou be asked for any involvement what so ever when it does not benefit us and will actually add to the provinces debt. I beleive the handout should stop for everything. sobeys, michelin, stora, the cbc,the commonwealth games and Costco in the chain lake industrial park which is an arm of the chinesse government. The city of halifax provided the land for 1 dollar with it serviced and cleared plus a 20 year tax holiday. Too bad the sobeys have to compete against the chinesse paying nothing to the HRM.
Half of downtown Halaifax is owned by sobeys yet they didnt have that deal for scotia square???
you see in pictou county we just happen to have a coal fired electric generating plant for emera. Not one dine is paid in commercial tax to the town of trenton. This plant was build to supply the increased demand in nova scotia and that has come from the HRM and other areas.
Tuff cove however has Emera and the prior company nova scotia power paying 5 million a year in taxes to Dartmouth and then the HRM. So who is on more of the government purse and who has the discomfort of generating power with dirty coal for the city.
The funds that are being hijacked for a commonwealth games provincially could be used to convert trenton to natural gas thus making living in this province a little fairer or atleast a little cleaner. Hey the 5 million a year you can keep just remember what this part of the province has to go thru to turn the lights on in metro.

More blah blah blah bull shit from this loser. He says the same things over and over agian. He really needs to get a life. This isn't a type of forum to be arguing about stuff,
but all this guy wants to do is cause confrontation. Go away will ya.
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
so why do you call it bullshit.if you like I can e mail you every article I have found on the subject one by one and you can look for yourself. That would be about 100 days of e mails. But hey you will just deny the facts and ignore it to have a stadium that will be millions to maintian every year. I actually have the articles as far as the costs of a commonwealth games and I have yet to be presented one single article saying that there are any benefits at all . You see you are part of the 17 people on BOB who love to close your eyes and think that decent on the issue is unpatriotic or treasonous. If I didn t like you attending startrek conventions dressed as an clingon or went to apple world in boston would I be a traitor????? No I would be a person who can deal with the reality COMMOWEALTH GAMES EQUALS 2 BILLION IN DEBT
with not federal funds from a stephen harper government. The same time you ask the rest of nova scotia to pony up money.
No that type of thinking is actually very idiotic.

Heres a question for you .

What costs more the tv rights to the commonwealth games for south africa or a Hynundai Excel
Answer $ 12,000 for the CWG rights for south africa and $ 13,995 for the Excel. And south africa then sublets that feed to the entire continent of africa .

Thing is the evdience is clearly there we need 600 million for a sewer system and we dont need a commonwealth games or a stadium for a cfl team that will be paying no rent or go bankrupt in a few short years.

Jim Jones
 

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Its kind of funny that even the nay-sayers in Manchester think that it was worth it now. The nay-sayers in Vancouver are now glad that Vancouver got the 2010 games. The problem with people like you is that you don't look past the end of your nose. I have never seen a positive post from you on anything CW or other issues. You are a very negative person and in case you haven't noticed this isn't a negitive forum. Nobody bashed other peoples cities or their own. This site is about speaking positve of development around the world. Your defestest negative comments do not belong here. I seen your posts on other forums and you say the same thing over and over again and this is why I call it bulll shit. You write alot and say nothing.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
and it bears repeating again and agian and again to people like yourself come out of the Sim City fantasy world. The commonwealth games are spent event commerically. I am reporting to the world this fact. totally a rip off even against many of the mutli sports events . You see little people like you seem to have the impression that all your dreams can come true with a stadium. Not true at all. Stadiums bring a tax load and professional sports leaches who dont pay rent let alone the costs to maintain .
The twisted towers by the way I have said is a very very good development for the city . May not in your image of a socialist state that trys to castrate any public debate on now tax money is spent.
Singapore rejected the commonwealth games TWICE, wellington new zealand dropped out against manchester and Calgary poop pooped the idea.Wales has opped out in the future, New zealand as well.

Oh then we here the stupid "oh those are just western sour grapes" statement by the CWG cult in hafifax.
Holly crap give your head a shake Calgary withdrew in september 3 months before the domestic bid was awarded.

Getting the games would be an economic diasaster but you know what you would even look at the facts. I shows your mental ability. Please show everyowhere any positive media story saving there is a profit. I have yet to see one and I did take the liberty to search on search engines "commonwealth games benefits". A KMPG report came up for melbourne stating 3 billion in spending for 1,5 billion in benefits.
Wow if a 50 cents on the dollar is great return I have some swamp land you might be interested in.

Jim Jones
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
HaliGuy said:
Its kind of funny that even the nay-sayers in Manchester think that it was worth it now. The nay-sayers in Vancouver are now glad that Vancouver got the 2010 games. The problem with people like you is that you don't look past the end of your nose. I have never seen a positive post from you on anything CW or other issues. You are a very negative person and in case you haven't noticed this isn't a negitive forum. Nobody bashed other peoples cities or their own. This site is about speaking positve of development around the world. Your defestest negative comments do not belong here. I seen your posts on other forums and you say the same thing over and over again and this is why I call it bulll shit. You write alot and say nothing.
Funny you still cant answer the question can you ?????
 

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Jonestowncultinpicto said:
and it bears repeating again and agian and again to people like yourself come out of the Sim City fantasy world. The commonwealth games are spent event commerically. I am reporting to the world this fact. totally a rip off even against many of the mutli sports events . You see little people like you seem to have the impression that all your dreams can come true with a stadium. Not true at all. Stadiums bring a tax load and professional sports leaches who dont pay rent let alone the costs to maintain .
The twisted towers by the way I have said is a very very good development for the city . May not in your image of a socialist state that trys to castrate any public debate on now tax money is spent.
Singapore rejected the commonwealth games TWICE, wellington new zealand dropped out against manchester and Calgary poop pooped the idea.Wales has opped out in the future, New zealand as well.

Oh then we here the stupid "oh those are just western sour grapes" statement by the CWG cult in hafifax.
Holly crap give your head a shake Calgary withdrew in september 3 months before the domestic bid was awarded.

Getting the games would be an economic diasaster but you know what you would even look at the facts. I shows your mental ability. Please show everyowhere any positive media story saving there is a profit. I have yet to see one and I did take the liberty to search on search engines "commonwealth games benefits". A KMPG report came up for melbourne stating 3 billion in spending for 1,5 billion in benefits.
Wow if a 50 cents on the dollar is great return I have some swamp land you might be interested in.

Jim Jones
Its not just about a staduim and CFL team. Its about creating a culture of sport and creating economic development. Giving this part of the country a postive image and amazing exposure and investment. Also I support the twisted towers very much so. If you think I am some kind of a socialist you are very wrong my friend. I support good investment that makes us less dependent on government.

I just did a quick search for some postive material and I got this document first thing. Pretty easy to find positive media on the games. You just choose to ignore it.

http://www.manchester.gov.uk/corporate/games/impact.htm
 

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"oh those are just western sour grapes" who said that?

Calgary dropped out because every major sporting event in last 30 years has been B.C and Alberta. They knew they would not win the domestic bid so why waste time and money on it.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
HaliGuy said:
"oh those are just western sour grapes" who said that?

Calgary dropped out because every major sporting event in last 30 years has been B.C and Alberta. They knew they would not win the domestic bid so why waste time and money on it.

well first I think montreal is in quebec and summer games was 30 years ago. Plus winnipeg hosted the the Pan Am games. Then what about all those events hosted in the metro centre? I think a world championship was held there.
Second Calgary had a study commissioned by the City Tourism association and Copa
(calgary olympic park association) officials . The result was the costs far out weighed any benefits. The canadain body of the commonwealth federation was dismayed that calgary withdrew saying that calgary would have done a great job with both many of the facillities already in place and the expertise on the ground from the winter games.

So if calgary was going to lose tell me why did the federation express dismay at the withdrawn of their bid 3 months before the domestic bid?????

It is all in print in the sept 15th edition of the calgary herald.

So with that in mind and that the province of alberta has a 14 billion dollar surplus for the last 12 months and could easily fund kuala lumpar, melbourne and manchester combined plus the montreal olympics and every commonwealth games from victoria back to hamilton why would calgary possibly worry about federal funding???? The reason calgary withdrew was their tourism people see what games opponents see here. A circus that attracts no audience globally of any meaning for a very high price.

The Reason the CWG people were destressed by Calgary pulling out was when the second most successful amateur sports event body in the history of all mankind turned the franchisethat is trouble for the business . That Clearly shows what you are chasing Commonwealth Games Fools Gold.

Remember these are the same (copa) people who cut a record 396 million dollar tv right deal with ABC. Something that had not happened before and will never happen again with American Idol slaughtering the Torino 2006 winter games in the american ratings.

If there was any multi-sports franchise Halifax should go for it would be the Pan AM Games. Pretty simple logic . You keep the european sports construction mob out of our business. You keep the european sporting bodies out like Fina who basically played economic chicken with Edmonton for the world aquatic championships in 2001 and then again with Montreal in 2005. Montreal lost 4.75 million on that experience with 16 million in funding from both the provincial and federal governements.Paul Martin put a hard cap on the funding despite it involving his very own riding. Ops sorry another world championship held in canada beyond the broaders of BC and Alberta. Gosh the former PM was willing to write a blank cheque there too LOLOLOLOL.
With the Pan AM Games You have the american market for tv
with americans competting, and thus exposure to the people who can easily get to this province. The entire tv market for those games within a 4 hour time zone range. Americans coming to Halifax as opposed no one from the rest of the commonwealth coming to Halifax,Nova Scotia when in many cases they watch it for free and the per person rights are worth 0.000016 cents per person in India or less in Africa??? is that Halifax Canada or is that Halifax England the games are in this year. I dont know either one I will never get to because I live in a straw hut in papua new guinea, or south africa or india or bangladish


Jim jones

Jim jones
 

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Edmonton 1978, Calgary 1988, Victoria 1994, Vancouver 2010. Do you really think that the west was due for another... give me a break. You keep referring to Montreal. That has no relevence in this argument because it was a mess due to corruption. Unless your saying Halifax is corrupt is that what your saying.
 
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