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Discussion Starter #5,621
The obvious solution isn't always the best solution - I think that's the key point. There are many routes into the centre of Manchester that wouldn't require tunnelling - especially from the west - however, it would then have difficulty reaching Piccadilly and thus reduce interchange opportunities.
 

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An opinion piece on re-opening the railway to Ripon: Why Ripon must be included in future North Yorkshire rail improvements

I think we can safely say that this is off the agenda for many decades to come, sadly.
We've been round the houses on this many times before. I think the view was that Harrogate-Ripon might just about be viable, but not through to Northallerton.

Not sure where the 40 minute journey time saving is coming from. Northallerton-Leeds is currently just over an hour.
 

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Discussion Starter #5,624
I'm not sure, but it would give you a more direct route north out of Leeds.

However, it would have big time savings on Leeds - Ripon journeys which currently can take nearly 2 hours by bus. Effectively, Leeds would be able to extend its commuter belt into the south eastern Dales, with Ripon being a comparable traffic generator to somewhere like Ilkley or Skipton.
 

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I'm not sure, but it would give you a more direct route north out of Leeds.

However, it would have big time savings on Leeds - Ripon journeys which currently can take nearly 2 hours by bus. Effectively, Leeds would be able to extend its commuter belt into the south eastern Dales, with Ripon being a comparable traffic generator to somewhere like Ilkley or Skipton.
There may be a case for extending a commuter route to Ripon from Harrogate. Certainly there is sufficient demand to run a high frequency bus service, the service can be run as an extension of an existing service, so no work needed at Leeds itself, and the route itself is largely free of obstructions.

In terms of a more direct North, while the distance from Leeds to Northallerton may be shorter via Ripon than York, the latter is a 90mph/125mph railway. The route via Ripon could never be made that fast. Leeds-Harrogate is 60mph at present and its alignment and existing busy commuter services preclude a significant increase. Also, long distance services going via Ripon would need to reverse at Leeds, crossing the entire western throat which would reduce capacity at Leeds. So I can't see it as an alternative long distance route. In fact the reason the ECML was four-tracked north of York was precisely to avoid using the Ripon route for long distance traffic.
 

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Surely re-opening the Harrogate - Ripon - Northallerton line would have the major benefit of creating a diversion route in the event of the East Coast Main Line between Northallerton and York being closed. Also re-opening the Harrogate - Northallerton line in full would have the benefit of allowing for additional longer distance journeys via Harrogate. Didn't many Transpennine services (Liverpool - Newcastle) once go via Harrogate when the Harrogate - Ripon - Northallerton line was open.
 

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Discussion Starter #5,627
I actually think a more viable option for all of this will come in the very long term if HS2 is ever extended northwards (of course we need to get the current plan built first so we're talking probably 2060 earliest here...). The HS line could run alongside the A1(M) out of Leeds, from the planned HS2 spur, on its way to Newcastle, giving the opportunity to build new local lines connecting Wetherby and Ripon to Leeds. Effectively the rail equivalent of the A168.
 

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Which is why it strikes me as odd they're building Leeds HS2 Station as a terminus. No scope for trains which run say Sheff to Leeds to Edinburgh.
 

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Surely re-opening the Harrogate - Ripon - Northallerton line would have the major benefit of creating a diversion route in the event of the East Coast Main Line between Northallerton and York being closed. Also re-opening the Harrogate - Northallerton line in full would have the benefit of allowing for additional longer distance journeys via Harrogate. Didn't many Transpennine services (Liverpool - Newcastle) once go via Harrogate when the Harrogate - Ripon - Northallerton line was open.
I'm yet to be convinced that diversionary routes are a significant benefit. Nice to have if they're there, but how much would they actually be used for that purpose? Especially when such a diversion would entail crossing the entire western throat of Leeds station with consequent reduction in capacity. And going via Harrogate means you miss out York which is a much bigger traffic generator. The only reasons long distance traffic used to go via Ripon was that the ECML north of York didn't have enough capacity. Quadrupling (in the 1950s I think) solved the issue and traffic was moved away from the Ripon route.
 

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Which is why it strikes me as odd they're building Leeds HS2 Station as a terminus. No scope for trains which run say Sheff to Leeds to Edinburgh.
Options for a link from HS2 into the current Leeds station are being looked at to address this. But most HS2 Leeds services don't need to continue north so a terminus makes sense.
 

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Interesting... Would that then mean the link would be of "High Speed" standards?
What do you mean by high speed standards? It would basically be a junction between the HS2 Leeds branch and the existing line from Castleford. It wouldn't need to be high speed as it's approaching the existing station. Unclear whether the gauge would be designed for double-deck trains as you'd then need to consider whether Leeds station itself would be re-engineered to take double-deckers too.
 

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^^ This Stourton Link is the one that TfN say they can't support.
Tensions rise at northern leaders' transport meeting as Greater Manchester mayor refuses to back plan for high speed rail station

According to this, they have found cost and disruption issues with the Stourton link but it's being kept in the mix until an alternative touchpoint has been identified. Whichever way, there is a commitment to linking HS2 into the existing network somewhere south of Leeds. Given the setting up of High Speed North recently to form a more integrated approach to HS2 and HS3 we may yet see further changes.
 

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What do you mean by high speed standards? It would basically be a junction between the HS2 Leeds branch and the existing line from Castleford. It wouldn't need to be high speed as it's approaching the existing station. Unclear whether the gauge would be designed for double-deck trains as you'd then need to consider whether Leeds station itself would be re-engineered to take double-deckers too.
Well if a train came from Sheff on high Speed route which called at Leeds enroute to future High Speed line to Edinburgh then would seem counter intuitive to crawl on old rails from South of Leeds to York?...
 

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Impact on transport as a result of Coronavirus including the following:
There will certainly have to be a lot done to encourage the use of public transport when the current Coronavirus outbreak has ended with people used to home working and driving to work as opposed to using public transport.

Also noticed a two carriage East Midlands Railway Intercity 125 on the Leeds City - Wakefield Westgate line near Elland Road stadium yesterday which was an unusual sight reminiscent of a Hornby train set. A stock move from Neville Hill down to the core Midland Mainline between Sheffield and London St Pancras or could there have been another reason for that train operating?
 

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I like the new plans, more modern design and even without the lights under it, it makes it a less oppressive design overall (less boxy & slimmer design).

Like LeedsLad has said - it would have been nice to incorporate some re-jigging of the road layout underneath & introduce segregated cycle lanes.

Does anyone know if there are plans to continue this into the New York Road Tunnel/bridge structure towards the Burmantofts/Marsh Lane junctions? I'm going to imagine since they were built at the same time as the RS Flyover and to same materials/techniques then surely that will need doing soon?
 
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