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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So i am waiting for a train now and have been for an hour. Despite checking the times earlier and buying my ticket online i get to the station and find out the train has left before it said online. Complained to staff and was told the online timetables mean nothing. Why do they exist then? What other business is allowed to do that? Imagine you did that with the cinema and the film had started twenty mins before it should have... Sorry our schedule is only a rough guide!
 

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Do you mean the PDFs to download or the route planner type thingies? If it's the latter then they should be accurate, especially the National Rail website. The PDFs are subject to change as they are produced too far in advance. Still, whatever the timetable is for today should be available - someone needed to tell the signalmen otherwise the trains wouldn't get to the right places, and if they have the info, it should be technically possible to make it available online.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thats what i used and this is what i was told at the station. This isnt the first time rail staff have said this either.
 

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I find nationalrail.co.uk to be accurate apart from on Sundays when it is consistantly out by around 5-10mins. Not useful given that i give myself only 5mins spare time.

this is the first time i have heard of it being out on a weekday.
 

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The online timetables should be accurate as they're provided by Network Rail and hence correspond to when train companies are allowed to run. I'd write to the company and also complain about the ignorance of the staff.

What station, btw?
 

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What time train was it and where from?

We can compare National Rail with for example a PDF of the companies printed timetable and see if there are any others.

I imagine the member of staff was just being flipant - but that is no excuse at all for the attitude.
 

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You should use what I use, I have a National Rail Sidebar on my desktop that tells me exactly how late or early my train is and tells you (live) exactly when its due.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I imagine the member of staff was just being flipant - but that is no excuse at all for the attitude.
i have had this happen three times in the past year - different members of staff. this is one of the things those twats told me at newark a few months ago, today it happened in lincoln, it happened in sheffield last summer - there was a single service that sunday and again they said "oh you should check the posters at the station!"
 

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i have had this happen three times in the past year - different members of staff. this is one of the things those twats told me at newark a few months ago, today it happened in lincoln, it happened in sheffield last summer - there was a single service that sunday and again they said "oh you should check the posters at the station!"
Just to clarify I was referring to the member of staffs attitude, not yours - I read it back and it looked a bit ambiguous.
 

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i have had this happen three times in the past year - different members of staff. this is one of the things those twats told me at newark a few months ago, today it happened in lincoln, it happened in sheffield last summer - there was a single service that sunday and again they said "oh you should check the posters at the station!"
Did you miss your train? I would of flipped out on them. :eek:hno:
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
yes i missed my train. every time i arrive at the station and find the train has left the staff *always* blame it on me being stupid enough to use online tables from national rail. no matter what station i am at or what train company its with - this tells me the attitude of the staff around the network is pretty much the same. any excuse to get rid of a customer.
 

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I'd say in general the attitude of the transport workers in general is pretty poor.

It tends to work in extremes, theres the really friendly helpful ones and twice as many permanently pissed off with a 'you're a **** because you asked me something' attitude.

One main problem are conductors. I know they might have a tricky job with some scumbags who just dont have tickets, but what about the time when my railcard was somewhere in my plane baggage (the big bag), and the **** told me i had to find it. This was on a 20 minute journey. He came after 10 mins. I looked for a bit, couldnt find it (but knew it was in there). Got to my stop where my whole family was waiting after my return from a year in the USA. Conductor got off the train and shouted over to me 'oi i told you i was coming back to see your railcard' (didnt it occur to him i was getting off there the dumbass) and interrupted my greetings while a heavy handed bloke at the station was getting worked up. In the end after empying my bag at the station i found the damn railcard and that was that. I know i should have had the card, but all it takes is some common sense.

Then theres the time when i was doing my usual journey and accidentally took the wrong route (which completely messed up my journey as i knew i'd have long connections and would get me home about an hour later). I had no choice but to continue along the route i had taken with my advance tickets for the other route. The conductor on the second train gave me a penalty full fare because i'd got on the wrong train because i missed my stop on the last one. I explained everything but he got shirty and gave me the penalty, despite this mistake having completely ruined my journey already. Maybe if it was a busy rush hour train i could have seen his reasoning, but this was some empty midday train. COMMON SENSE GUYS.

Dont get me started on bus drivers.

But as for the online timetables, ive not had any problems, i thought it was fixed.
 

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One main problem are conductors. I know they might have a tricky job with some scumbags who just dont have tickets, but what about the time when my railcard was somewhere in my plane baggage (the big bag), and the **** told me i had to find it. This was on a 20 minute journey. He came after 10 mins. I looked for a bit, couldnt find it (but knew it was in there). Got to my stop where my whole family was waiting after my return from a year in the USA. Conductor got off the train and shouted over to me 'oi i told you i was coming back to see your railcard' (didnt it occur to him i was getting off there the dumbass) and interrupted my greetings while a heavy handed bloke at the station was getting worked up. In the end after empying my bag at the station i found the damn railcard and that was that. I know i should have had the card, but all it takes is some common sense.

Then theres the time when i was doing my usual journey and accidentally took the wrong route (which completely messed up my journey as i knew i'd have long connections and would get me home about an hour later). I had no choice but to continue along the route i had taken with my advance tickets for the other route. The conductor on the second train gave me a penalty full fare because i'd got on the wrong train because i missed my stop on the last one. I explained everything but he got shirty and gave me the penalty, despite this mistake having completely ruined my journey already. Maybe if it was a busy rush hour train i could have seen his reasoning, but this was some empty midday train. COMMON SENSE GUYS.
Both those examples are your fault and your fault alone, but that does not excuse rudeness from them of course. Your calling the conductor a **** for doing his job (asking to see your railcard which MUST be produced when asked for). Can't really sympathise with you at all.

In the second example why should he not give you a penalty fair? It was through your own stupidity that you forgot to get off at your stop - it is not as if a rail company had caused you delay causing you to miss your train.

It is a wider problem in society - everyone is always looking for someone else to blame instead of accepting the consequences for their own actions.
 

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Yes, i know that they are my fault, but the conductors completely took the piss.

And yes i would call both of them twats because of their disgusting attitude towards me. Mostly Lurking - have you ever noticed PEOPLE MAKE MISTAKES. I know life is not fair and sometimes you get punished for them, but this was taking the mick. They even delayed the train for a bit while the problem got sorted in the first instance - was this really necessary for the sake of a railcard?

I tried to be nice but they get all officious and take on what i call the 'policeman persona'.

I think both of the problems i had should have been avoided and it was the conductor who created the problem, not me. On both occasions a little bit of common sense would go a long way, but I suppose these guys are on targets to catch people out arent they. THIS is the wider problem in society - the profit making train companies looking to screw over people for the smallest and most innocent mistakes to get their own bonus and swell the fat cats at the top of the companies pockets. Not my little mistakes - which you call stupid, well i take issue with that too because:

1. I'd been away in the USA for a year, accidentally put my railcard in the bag somewhere. 90% of conductors dont even ask for railcards if you are clearly within the age range (well done to these guys - common sense, what we need). I'd been 2 trains previous to that from the airport and neither asked for it (and the conductor would have known i had been on previous trains from my ticket).

2. The other problem was maybe borderline stupidity. The journey i did goes the route i took 4 out of 5 times, so most of the time i would have been perfectly fine. And also, this ticket was introduced while i was in the USA when previously i would have been fine on any route so it didnt really occur to me that it would be a problem.
 

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Maybe the Train Companies are all just laughing at customers who believe the railway is run for their benefit and not the shareholders :lol:
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
he has a point mostly_lurking. the british legal system and specifically contracts is based on the idea of it being equitable to both parties. clearly the relationship between the passenger and the train company is not equitable. the passenger must compensate the train company in full for the slightest mistake but the train company need not do otherwise. its completely unfair, and so when the customer is in the wrong, it creates an impression of being totally out of order. why should there be one rule for rail comapnies and another for customers.

there isn't when anyone has tried to challenge this in court from a contractual point of view the rail company always drops legal action to get their money much like banks do with being sued for bank charges, they crumble. almost no customer ever does it from that point of view though and those that are usually prosectued for fare dodging didnt have a fare to begin with or were trying it on. rail companies arent stupid enough to try and make too much money out of the issue and therefore end up with a high court ruling that completely buggers up their profitable compensation and penalty fares structure.

i have had a conductor try to penalty fare me because i was on the wrong train - the fact i was on it because the previous service had been cancelled so it was impossible to catch was neither here nor there to him. i very clearly explained him the concept of equitable contractual terms and explained that if he tried to give me a penalty fare i would refuse to pay. he went to check i was telling the truth about the past train being late, and then went away after lecturing me for starting on a connection from lincoln to newark that didnt give enough time to wait at newark as if you arrive ten mins before your cancelled service you were catching should have arrived and didnt it was your fault for arriving too soon. make sense? what he should have said was "we're sorry the last train was cancelled so you couldn't catch it" instead of treating me like a criminal in front of everyone else on the coach. if i had not argued with him i would have paid the penalty fare he originally demanded.

train companies are increasingly a law unto themselves but unlike other businesses they are actually backed up by british transport police for things any other business would have to sue for in a court of civil law! i have never been rude or discourteous to anyone working for a railway company, i have been assaulted by rail staff, i have been lied to, i have been verbally abused by them, i have had my time wasted and i have had them try to con me. i have even had one accuse me of being on drugs, im sorry for being hard of hearing and unable to lip read you well because you dont speak english very well.

on a wider scale we have had FGW actually wrongly set the ticket prices in their machines, overcharge customers, when they get caught keep overcharging and not refunding the money they have wrongly taken. of course they werent prosecuted either, the govt wants those franchise payments. if you or i did that in a shop we owned, skimming off the top of credit cards we would be shut down.

what makes me saddest of all is how the ECML customer service levels have been completely buggered up. gone is GNER much missed and replaced by the same rude jokers you see elsewhere. i now drive to london and its cost them between 1500 and 2000 a year in lost revenue but what do they care. there's always more gimps to take the train isnt there?

its reaching the point where i am getting to driving everywhere rather than taking the train because i find the experience so often unpleasant and one reason for that is rude and generally ignorant staff who are unable to apologise for a mistake, try and blame the customer. if someone working for me did that to one of my clients i would sack them on the spot.

if the customer has made a mistake they should be sympathetic, not act like twats. they should treat the customers as their posters *demand* they are treated in return and its pretty clear thats what republica is complaining about.
 

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i have had a conductor try to penalty fare me because i was on the wrong train - the fact i was on it because the previous service had been cancelled so it was impossible to catch was neither here nor there to him. i very clearly explained him the concept of equitable contractual terms and explained that if he tried to give me a penalty fare i would refuse to pay. he went to check i was telling the truth about the past train being late, and then went away after lecturing me for starting on a connection from lincoln to newark that didnt give enough time to wait at newark as if you arrive ten mins before your cancelled service you were catching should have arrived and didnt it was your fault for arriving too soon. make sense? what he should have said was "we're sorry the last train was cancelled so you couldn't catch it" instead of treating me like a criminal in front of everyone else on the coach. if i had not argued with him i would have paid the penalty fare he originally demanded.
MASSIVE difference between your example (rail companies fault) and the previous example (customers fault). Quite clearly you should not of been hassled by the conductor - but the previous poster quite rightly was. And the legal system has nothing at all to do with it in the example given of forgetting to get off at the right stop.

As for the rest of your post... I wasn't defending any aspect of customer service.
 

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I've used the online time tables and they are normally correct. Every train I've got in the last few months has left on the minute. If there is a problem on the line which has happen due to idiots robbing copper cabling then it all goes to pot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
the legal system has nothing at all to do with it in the example given of forgetting to get off at the right stop.
no, the legal system has to do with the amount of damages to be paid. they should be comparable for both parties.
 
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