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2.8M views 19K replies 451 participants last post by  mikemcniven  
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#1 ·
Since there isn't a thread that groups together non-Metrolink public transport here is a new one, bit late for the M60 widenning (finishes in a couple of weeks), however, BBC NW news this morning reporting that Virgin are set to increase the frequency and the speed of the Manchester to London trains.

Given they take 2hrs at the moment and run every 30mins they sure are going to be very very good competition for the planes.

All good stuff in my opinion, no doubt Virgin will put a press release out later that will be reported in the MEN.
 
#123 ·
ya i know 20p hike i have to pay it everyday to get to college
is stupid espessially when it costs £1.40 to go into college and back home put together is stupid being a student is costly enought without bus charge going up
 
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#124 ·
flange said:
ya i know 20p hike i have to pay it everyday to get to college
is stupid espessially when it costs £1.40 to go into college and back home put together is stupid being a student is costly enought without bus charge going up
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Going to college is not too bad - the £30 a week grants were brought in to cover expenses like that.
Its mums wanting to go shopping with 3 or 4 kids I feel sorry for.
 
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#125 ·
Sorry this is going back a bit:

jrb said:
London in 90 minutes on £14bn super-line

A PLANNED new super-high-speed railway line could cut the journey time from Manchester to London to just 90 minutes.

Network Rail is considering building a £14bn track which would run adjacent to the existing West Coast mainline.

The line would start in Glasgow and run through Manchester on its way to London.

Advertisement your story continues below
Tilting trains, running flat out at 180 mph, could mean a trip from Glasgow to London would take three hours and Manchester to the capital just 90 minutes - shaving more than half an hour off current times.

The latest tilting trains are currently limited to 125mph because of the old track. Until 2008, when upgrading work is completed, trains have to slow down around Rugby.

Network Rail's deputy chief executive Iain Coucher was expected to unveil the proposals at a conference by the Institution of Civil Engineers today in London.

Mr Coucher was also expected to tell the conference that Network Rail has estimated the line could be built for between £11bn and £14bn. A fleet of electric trains - similar to the TGVs operating in France - will cost another £650m.

For the scheme to be viable, the firm has calculated that the service will need to carry 21m passengers a year within a decade and 30m in 15 years' time.

A spokesman for Network Rail admitted the proposals did exist and added: "It's one of the options that will be discussed. Before any plans go ahead, they need to be based on sound business costings - which have yet to be carried out."

David Sidebottom - north west spokesman for Passenger Focus, which is dedicated to getting travellers the best deal - said that one of the main problems with the new proposal would be generating the cash to build the infrastructure.

He said: "The notion of building another line at the side of the current one is the equivalent of building another motorway at the side of the M6."
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Tilting trains on an HSL?

Rational Plan said:
I saw a graphic some where showing the line with a station at the Airport before going to the city centre.
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Maybe a station in the Salford area and a chord to serve Manchester Piccadilly?

Metrolink said:
Article in this weeks NW Enquirer (great paper BTW) about National Rails proposals for high speed rail.

Basically, looking at a £14bn line from London to Glasgow / Edinburgh via Brum and Manc.

It seems to be the only viable high speed option that would meet government criteria for funding in this country (although that is far from certain).

The article points out a much bigger hurdle will be the political pressure to include links to Liverpool, Leeds and Newcastle - however, doing so would ensure the proposals were not economically viable.

The conclusion seems to be we'll end up getting improved capacity, simply to keep those other cities happy, they'd rather we all got nothing rather than the areas that can justify the high speed rail (according to government criteria) getting improvements that may one day be expanded to their areas - ain't this working together great!!!

Can see why London does so well - each of the northern cities are bikkering every time one of them seems to be getting an 'advantage'.
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I'd have thought re-using the alignment of the former GCR would be a better choice as it serves the well populated M1 corridor, and can continue to the North East and Scotland and can have branches to Birmingham and to the North West either by following the A50 or the Woodhead alignment. That way more people get served.

I can understand a west coast 'shadow' being chosen because of the numbers the WCML currently carries. But you have to understand cities like Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield, etc have every right to be up in arms about it because they would be left out of something that is likely to be a great boost to the economy.

Just a suggestion (red=HSL, blue=upgraded classic line):

Image


Hope you don't mind me dragging this back up.
 
#126 ·
Image

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Anyone seen these photos of Antwerpen Centraal.

They've basically cut into the station and shoved a line underneath it.

They could do that at Picadilly and sink the Pendolinos into the approaching viaduct and stop them in the undercroft, leaving loads of room for suburban trains to enter the upper station and cross onto the Oxford Rd line.
 
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#127 ·
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6520877.stm

Rail network given cash injection

Network Rail is investing in new tracks and improving stations
Network Rail has announced plans to invest £2.4bn in railway expansion over the next two years.
The schemes will include lengthening hundreds of platforms, introducing speed increases on certain lines, new tracks and major resignalling.

The improvements will be carried out from this month to March 2009.

Chief executive John Armitt said the investment was a response by Network Rail to the rising demand for rail travel in the UK.

Network Rail will provide £1.73bn in funding, with the rest of the money coming from other sources such as the Department for Transport and local authorities.

Some of the schemes that are to be introduced over the next two years include projects connected with the 2012 Olympics, on which £109 million will be spent by March 2009.

There are also new platforms planned at Manchester Airport station and at King's Cross in London as well as £165m of new track in the Trent Valley.

RAIL INVESTMENT HIGHLIGHTS
New line from Airdrie to Bathgate - £214m (£300m in total)
London Olympics schemes - £109m (£400m)
Trent Valley track doubling scheme - £165m (£300m)
Thameslink station at St Pancras - £78m (£78m)
New station at East Midlands Parkway - £24m - (£24m)

Mr Armitt said: "Three million people use the railways each day, more than at any time in the past 60 years, and we're not standing still waiting for the big infrastructure projects to be delivered.

Mr Armitt told the BBC that the investment would make the experience of using trains "better".

He said: "The improvements we're making, particularly on lengthening platforms, will enable longer trains which reduces overcrowding.

"Improving stations makes people's travel experience better; improving car parks enables them to use the trains and to get less hassle on their journey in the mornings and in the evenings."

The announcement comes after a difficult period for Network Rail. In February, the company accepted the initial findings of a preliminary rail accident investigation which said the train derailment in Cumbria, in which one person died, was caused by faulty points.

Then the Office of Rail Regulation said it was concerned the company was underspending on the railways.

And last week Network Rail was fined £4 million for Health and Safety at Work Act breaches by its predecessor Railtrack in connection with the 1999 Paddington rail crash, which killed 31 people.
 
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#129 ·
Isaac Newell said:
Anyone seen these photos of Antwerpen Centraal.

They've basically cut into the station and shoved a line underneath it.

They could do that at Picadilly and sink the Pendolinos into the approaching viaduct and stop them in the undercroft, leaving loads of room for suburban trains to enter the upper station and cross onto the Oxford Rd line.
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Sure Manchester Piccadilly has enough room to add more platforms if need be?

Might be good for a future HSL though as long as it could then go under Manchester and perhaps head up to Preston and so on.
 
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#132 ·
There is room for more platforms at piccadilly to the north. Look on Google earth, you can see an area to the north on the main approach which is unused. This used to be a freight line to depots on the other side of store street.

I would say that 2 or 3 platforms could b put here at little cost (relative).
 
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#133 · (Edited)
Gavin said:
There is room for more platforms at piccadilly to the north. Look on Google earth, you can see an area to the north on the main approach which is unused. This used to be a freight line to depots on the other side of store street.

I would say that 2 or 3 platforms could b put here at little cost (relative).
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True, but the real issue with capacity at Piccadilly is at the station throat and Platforms 13/14, not the terminal platforms. Have a read of the North West RUS and the recently released route plan via jrb's link above.

From Dec 2008 Virgin with require an additional platform slot for their 20 min frequency to Euston, but it is looking highly likely that the 'eastern' services from Piccadilly (Marple, Rose Hill and Sheffield stoppers) will be diverted to Victoria at the same time to free up capacity and improve performance at Piccadilly.

This ties in nicely with a revamped Victoria and potential new platforms at Salford Central and Salford Crescent to facilitate more cross-city journeys and interchange without impacting on the performance of the congested Deansgate - Piccadilly corridor.
 
#134 ·
Just got back from Oslo and thier station's platforms simply incline downwards and then go under the city.
Bearing in mind that Piccadilly is raised, it would (hyperthetically) easy to find room to create tunnels.

also, on a completey different topic....

I was looking a google earth. A lot on here have said that the small width of the oxford road viaduct is a problem for traffic.

Would it be hard to create a station along Charles street? All that is physically stopping it is a corner of the white building on oxford rd, and that horrible 60's blot half way down charles st.
If transpennine stopped here instead of Picc, the line would still be free for all other traffic.

London Euston - Old Trafford Football Ground??

Anyone?

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#138 ·
As our creaking, over-stretched, over-priced trains continue to pack in passengers like sardines, the British look with envy across the Channel.

France's train à grande vitesse proved worthy of its name yesterday by breaking the world railway speed record.

At nearly 360 mph, the TGV rocketed from Strasbourg to Paris at almost three times the cruising speed of Britain's "high-speed" trains. It is also, rather cleverly, a double-decker - a design that would certainly help us combat overcrowding. But when it comes to high-capacity fast trains, our bridges are too low, our tracks too old, our locomotives too dated, our signalling infrastructure too old-fashioned.


Is it any wonder that, this Easter, despite the warnings from the environmental lobby, we will pile into our cars and face the inevitable holiday gridlock on the motorways? At least we'll be guaranteed a seat.
 
#140 ·
From Transport Briefing:

Network Rail drops plan to close three stations
Filed 02/05/07

Proposals to shut three stations in Greater Manchester have been shelved after residents and passenger groups persuaded Network Rail that long term development could improve the business case for keeping the stations open.

Publishing its North West Route Utilisation Strategy yesterday (1 May) Network Rail said it would not pursue, for the time being, the closure of Ardwick, Denton and Reddish South stations which was included in the draft RUS (Transport Briefing 13/11/06). However, the infraco says it will reconsider closure if the stations require significant amounts of money spending on them in the future.

Commenting on the decision, MP for Denton & Reddish Andrew Gwynne said: "This shows that Network Rail has taken on board the views of people in Reddish and Denton. The decision not to close our stations is the first step in our campaign to get a proper service into Manchester Victoria. Network Rail's wise decision has now made this a realistic possibility. I am now working with the Greater Manchester Passenger Transport Authority to put forward a strong business case for this new service."

Network Rail's North West Route Utilisation Strategy sets out plans for meeting anticipated passenger and freight growth over the next 10 years. Short term plans to be implemented between now and 2009 include providing more peak capacity between Manchester and Liverpool with additional carriages on trains and longer platforms to accommodate them - particularly on the routes serving Manchester Victoria. Platform 'furniture' and some buildings on platforms 13/14 at Manchester Piccadilly and Salford Crescent will be removed to increase space for passengers and an additional Manchester to Preston hourly off peak service will be introduced and possibly extended to Blackpool. Network Rail also wants to develop park-and-ride interchanges at Guide Bridge and Newton-le-Willows.

Between 2009 and 2014 Network Rail expects the government to authorise up to 50 additional carriages to strengthen peak hour services on routes into Manchester and Liverpool, together with lengthening platforms where necessary to take 4-car trains. New platforms are proposed at Salford Central to allow Victoria to Liverpool services to call there, plus the relocation of Salford Crescent station to provide extra capacity for Bolton and Calder Valley services and offer improved interchange opportunities across central Manchester.

The infraco says it will investigate the case for electrification of the Manchester Victoria to Liverpool and Huyton to Wigan routes. These studies will be undertaken after the Department for Transport concludes its current consideration on electrification policy later this year. It also hopes to increase speeds across a number of junctions to the east of Manchester, and within the Glossop/Hadfield triangle, to improve performance.

In the long term, beyond 2014, Network Rail is looking at further expansions of train capacity between Manchester and Liverpool, lengthened platforms, improvements in freight capacity on routes serving Trafford Park, faster maximum speed on the Atherton line and building an interchange facility with Metrolink at Cornbrook or White City.

Route director Peter Strachan said: "This RUS broadly covers the Manchester journey-to-work area. We published a draft in November and invited key sections of the business community and local authorities to tell us what they thought of our proposals. We have listened to what they told us and looked again at some of the calculations to produce something the whole rail industry and everyone involved in it can work towards over the next 10 years."
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